Ok,
Just got back from Telford yesterday were I got this
for £12 not bad for a 1/18 scale Helo! now I'm thinking should I hang it up a a ceiling toy or rub it down and do a better paint job on it?.
now recently I've seen articles in a mag were they have redone a figure and had lots of negitive feedback on the letters page.
So it got me wondering as many of these are cheaper than their 1/35 counterparts what are your views on them? they are very cheap and it would be fun to see one with scratch built added detail ect.
So would you see this as a new avenue for modllers to explore or just a gimmick?
heres a link to some of the other 1/18 range

I saw the F-15 and F-18. Man those are huge! The box says it's accurate. Maybe the paintjob only needs a redo.

WOW! A Sherman!

There's been some debate lately to the state of these "kits" in our club,,,IMHO they are nothing but toys, already put together, be it planes, tanks whatever. I saw a 1:18 Tiger in Toys r Us, and although looked pretty cool, it's not something I would buy. We have someone in our club who collects these things, does a little rework to them and calls it a model. We put all of our hard work into our builds, and these things come along. It's like the big diecast cars that are out now...DEFINATELY not my cup of tea...but each to his own...

One guy in my local club has that exact same helicopter. He actually bought it because the company he works for does the sight system for the helicopter. He combined his modeling skills with his work requirement to make the mock up of some new sighting device.

He detailed out the helicopter and scratchbuilt the new apparatus. He was surprised that most of the folks working on the project never even knew what the helicopter looked like that they were developing the sight for.

Although he made it look respectable, you could tell it was still a "toy". He noted that some of the dimensions were off due to the fact that it had to accept action figures and also a lot of details were simplified. I thought it looked pretty good though.

If someone is doing their own work - i.e. 'accurizing' one of these models, I personally have no problem with it - on the contrary, more power to them .

I have actually seen (from a previous thread here) a series of posts about rebuilding and detailing a Stuart in a similar scale. Their are even AM parts available....

I have no doubt that some of the Keepers Of The Sacred Flame Of Modelling , are indignant about this kind of work. Strangely enough, they don't seem quite so indignant when dealing with the 'motorized' Tamiya kits of the 1970s ...

Modelling is after all a 'broad church' personally I could be tempted as well if I found a decent subject to start with.

What's better? Converting and super-detailing these or paying someone to do the models for you? ..Jim

That I would believe is a rip o , oops, replica of the Tamiya M4A3 105 Howitzer, judging by the markings and stowage.....needs a better barrel though, this looks a bit large.. The white wash leaves a lot to be desired, looks more like a flash whiteout of the picture... Not my cup of tea either, but if it floats your boat, go for it. Just another addition to the broad scoop of models available. Some people try to be as close to scale and originality as possible (PE Boltheads and rivets, completely detailed interiors which are then closed up inside..) and others are just as happy with something simple OOB.

Cheers
Henk

The motorized Tamiya kits of the'70's still required the person to assemble the whole kit.

To me these things are just re-worked toys. Cudos to the guy who puts the effort into making it more presentable, but it reminds me of the "Lipstick on the pig" quote.

Hey Dave, i to have some of those helicopters, UH-1, Little Bird and the Cobra in grey. The huey i got in the summer and the other two will get for christmas. Also have this rifle from Airsoft.

uh-1c is 31in long

m16 is 1/1 scale

In answer to the question, i.e. are they toys or models, I think they are both!

They are not wholey accurate, although do present a nice out of the box minitaure (toy / model )representation of the real thing.

I think the marketing department and production of these has tried to be very clever and aimed at, 1.) the kids and toys, 2.) the collectors, and 3.) the modeller / scratchbuilder with a view of a half decent base to start work with.
I know a great deal of large scale military collectors who have many of these, along with Tamiya, Bandai 1/16, 1/15, etc.

I think the thing is with these, is if you are after a larger scale version of a particular vehicle and no other kits are available, then get one of these......with a bit of modding, and re-painting, they can look exactly as you wish them to look.

Personally, I would be more than happy with one of these if nothing else was available in this scale.
I have always wanted a large scale Huey for my office and have often contemplated one of these, re-worked and re-painted, although I would to be honest be quite happy with the "out-of-the-box" product considering the application required.

Stupidly, the only things that stopped me purchasing the Huey was because my "other half" said but you won't have your fun building it!!! and I wasn't entirely sure how much work would be involved in making it more accurate, so walked away leaving it for another day!

I have a question to all of you out there-same as the tread-is it a toy or a model? My example.

Dusty Trail Toys
They make a very nice figurines... I purchased their Iraq troops (they look like 120mm, perhaps bigger)... I build dios for them but here is the twist-I take them completely apart-brake it down into parts, then glue, prime, fill, sand and paint just as a regular model... so would this then be a model or a toy?

I have done this with Wolverine action toys where I glued all joints and filled them with putty and then repainted them completely-it was a lot of fun. Its a heck of a lot less expensive than buying a garage kit.
I have even picked up some of the Spawn Figures to make into a futuristic Special OP display (planning to cast a leg and an arm in clear and blend it in-kind of like a special ops using the Predator camouflage system).


So would you consider this making a model or just playing with a toy??? Would a model show allow me to enter one in since the process was the same with the addition of a dissasembly???

Good point Tommy.

However I think that you are leaning more towards the model side than the toy given the fact that you took the time to break down the subject and completely rebuild it. As opposed to the guys who just add on a few items and give it a new coat of paint.

As for allowing it to be entered in competition............I think I'll sit back and listen to the arguments before forming my own opinion. Too much grey area on this one.

to me personally it is a scale (or near enough) representation of the real thing so I would concider it a model.

just because it is assembled and painted and not parts that you have to put togeather and paint does not mean it is a toy.

I am getting shortly from a friend a lot of die-cast stuff that are ideal for converting to the odd ball trucks I like. Sure I will be ripping them apart and rebuilding with scratch built items but even as they are I concider them to be MODEL TRUCKS and NOT TOYS.

these are the items that will drive the plastic kit assembly companies broke due to their cheapness and accuracy. The likes of Tamiya and Italeri should take note and change their ways to conbat this treat.

Just my 5 cents worth

I agree with Cliff on this one - some of the diecast stuff (apart from the obvious problems of constant scale) is actually damned good and as I said before, don't discard something just because it is sold as a toy...

I don't think anyone was advocating getting one of these toys and simply giving it a paint job. There are (IMHO) more possibilities with the large scale armor 'toys' than with the aircraft - the helicopters to me at least, look extremely toy-like...

One thing that should be considered as well, is just how much you are prepared to pay. The R/C Stuart with all the 'bells and whistles' turns into a hell of an expensive undertaking...Jim

Yes Jim, I would agree.
Although, having said that,...the 1/6 Stuart is actually one of the CHEAPEST R/C 1/6 scale alternatives around, when compared to the others that range between £1400.00 - £6000.00.

Horses for courses.

I believe that technically it is a model. It may not be built by them, but so long as it is a smaller scale version of an actual thing it is a model..

I'd say these were primarily toys, given the "working" features, as opposed to collectibles. If someone wants to buy them for their oown pleasure, that's fine. If you plan on showing it, you really need to strip and repaint it as well as accurizing it to claim it as your own work. We had a guy in the club who ruined his reputation by bringing die casts and promos to competition and asking they not be picked up.

As to reworking figures, there's a whole parallel hobby working on the current crop of 12 inch action figures. Here's a link to some done by Don WInar, a respected figurist. He and his partner, Rob Caswel, did a presentation at a meeting last year. The end result is a far cry for the GI Joes of the past. Their aftermarket has accessories like boots for up to $135 (not a typo!) a pair. Here's an example of what those guys can do:

Don't forget, folks: the vast majority of the general public considers models to be toys anyway.
So the point is moot!

But in our little world of modelling, I'd consider it a "toy" (albeit a dang nice one) if you just bought it, brought it home, and that was that.
I'd consider it a "model" if you took it apart, fixed all the toy-like aspects, added necessary detail, and repainted the whole thing, with all the appropriate weathering and whatnot. I've done that myself with several of the 1/24 Tokyo Marui R/C tanks. I proudly display them right next to all my other models (real toys go in the toybox, of course!).

Calling it a toy or a model really doesn't matter, of course. It's all good!

Perhaps we could reach a middle ground and call them all "replicas."

Whatever floats your boat!