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Modeling in General
General discussions about modeling topics.
Being Priced Out
nheather
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 09:29 PM UTC
Model kits are getting too expensive for me.

For the sort of subjects I want I generally have to pay £35-£45 now and to be honest my modelling skills simply don't justify that sort of money.

£40 is not a lot of money if you are going to end up with a show winning masterpiece but not for a mediocre job.

Okay, if I wanted to build a model then I could justify £40 as a reasonable price for x hours of entertainment.

Trouble is, like many, I collect a stash and build very slowly. So with the prices now I'm finding it very hard to justify buying more rather than running down my stash.

When to a military show this weekend (TankFest) with £100 to spend on bargains at the model shop stalls.

Last year I came back with three models. This year I came back with £100.

Looking around the show it wasn't just me either. Normally there would be a lot of interest around the stalls and you seem any visitors carrying around kits that they had bought - a lot less so this year.

Cheers,

Nigel
Tojo72
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 10:04 PM UTC
Rock Concerts,American Football games,and Broadway Shows are getting too expensive for me.So I stopped going.yea,it's not fun and not fair,but a lot of things are being priced out of people's reach.So we limit our choices,build our stashes,and search for bargains,which according to many modelers are still out there.I will get really concerned when food and housing become to expensive for me.
retiredyank
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 10:25 PM UTC
I would recommend buying cheap, then super detailing. If you skills don't allow this, practice. If you ruin a few $30 kits, oh well. Hopefully, you learned something and won't make the same mistake(s) on the next build. And, you have increased your hours of fun by "x".
Karl187
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 10:37 PM UTC
What sort of model subjects are you into Nigel?
I mostly do modern stuff myself and new kits can be expensive but I can get the same (or sometimes more) enjoyment out of a much older kit built straight from the box that costs maybe £10-£18- with this you can do it OOB or as Matt suggested you could super-detail it or go for a challenge- for instance maybe weather it in a way you haven't before or try a new paint scheme or something like that.
nheather
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 10:39 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I would recommend buying cheap, then super detailing. If you skills don't allow this, practice. If you ruin a few $30 kits, oh well. Hopefully, you learned something and won't make the same mistake(s) on the next build. And, you have increased your hours of fun by "x".



Super detailing is well beyond my current skills.

You may have missed my point - I have plenty of decent kits in my stash - I find some of the enjoyment comes from building up the stash.

What I'm saying is that I'm finding new kits are getting too expensive (in the last couple of years I have seen the typical Tamiya, DML, Bronco, Trumpeter etc. kits rise from around £30 to £40+. So rather than continuing to extend my stash I'm just making myself happy with what I have already.

Cheers,

Nigel
retiredyank
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 11:34 PM UTC
Ah. OK. I have noticed a definite increase in the price of Tamiya and Italeri kits. The new Tamiya kits run ~$60, at my lhs. They don't even stock Italeri, anymore. Even on EBay, the Italeri kits have increased 100 fold.
FAUST
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2013 - 11:43 PM UTC
Ola Nigel

I'm with you on the price increase of the kits nowadays. I don't know how it is on the other side of the Channel but here it is also due to the importers and the shops who all increase the price immensely. Up to the point where it is simply out of my range. The only local shop dares to increase their prices with up to 20% on a kit depending on brand and size of the box. It is really ridiculous. I'm all for supporting the local shops but at these prices they make it very hard for me to do so. I usually go there to have a good laugh at the kit prices and buy some paint. I haven't bought a factory fresh kit for years not even at events.

I do however often buy kits on messageboards here in Holland where there are people who buy every new kit that arrives on the market only to sell it at half price a few months later and that is where I usually pick them up. Most of the kits I have bought either come from there. Or second hand kits at Events and I shop a lot on Ebay where you can still score some amazing bargains.
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 12:11 AM UTC
I walked around the tankfest stalls on Saturday and while there were not as many stalls as I remember from previous shows the mix was good. I even found a stall selling a selection of DML kits for £30 each, and another with a very good selection of models from a large number of retailers, yes these were not really bargains from the secomd stall but there were a few good buys and he was knocking about 10% off of the displayed price.

Be glad you don't do re-enacting as it cost my daughter £200 for a jacket and tin hat.
firstcircle
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 12:21 AM UTC
Nigel, I agree that kits like you mention seem poor value, and think it's partly due to modelling now being identified more with middle aged people with disposable incomes instead of with kids with pocket money. Partly too it's built up by many modellers themselves worshipping ever greater levels of specification in the kits.

Some suggestions, that may not be of help...
As mentioned elsewhere on the site, Netmerchants currently have a sale on, covering various lines, but especially Italeri (wonder if they're winding that line down...) and it is possible there to get 1/35 kits for under £20 and £30.

Ebay of course - sometimes it's cheaper to get from Eastern Europe etc. even with the postal charges if you're buying kits by Russian / Ukrainian etc. makers.

Have you considered moving down a scale or two? You mention the outlay not being worthwhile for your skill level, maybe 1/72 scale might help there - you can turn over more finished models but still use and develop identical skills with painting etc. Many kits in this scale can be picked up in the £5 to £15 range.

Then there's charity shops and places like TK Maxx; I've often seen Revell kits in TK Maxx, bought a couple, and bought Trumpeter's Morsar Karl kit in a local charity shop for half price.

Admittedly bargain hunting does mean you're more looking at chance purchases instead of being able to choose exactly what it is that you want to build and when, but that's also part of the fun, maybe.
nheather
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 02:22 AM UTC
1/72 is too small and besides I have a large investment in 1/35 in my stash.

If I were starting afresh I might consider 1/48.

Never seen any kits in TK-Max though I have to admit I can count on one hand the number of times I have been in one of their stores.

I have had some very good deals in ModelZone in the past - but not this year and it looks like they are closing anyway.

Cheers,

Nigel
mat
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 04:11 AM UTC
I have the same feeling. It seems that plastic is going to be as expensive as resin. I can afford the kits but I just think you have to pay too much for what you get. So I am eating up my stash. I also noticed that on model shows you hardly see people buying kits. A few years ago you saw people walking around with piles of boxes, last year I hardly so anyone with a kit.

On the other hand, since I stopped buying kits I started spending more time on building them. More weathering, make a dio, some scratchbuilding. This made the hobby much more fun for me in the end
retiredyank
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 04:52 AM UTC
In my opinion, you should base the price you are willing to pay by how many hours of enjoyment you get out of it. For example, I will pay up to $50 for a Dragon or Cyber Hobby Ltd. I can expect a two week build time. At six hours, per day; that means I am getting eighty four hours of enjoyment for $2-3 dollars per hour. If I really want to increase my build time, I'll purchase some am parts(usually etch).
nheather
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 07:29 AM UTC

Quoted Text

In my opinion, you should base the price you are willing to pay by how many hours of enjoyment you get out of it. For example, I will pay up to $50 for a Dragon or Cyber Hobby Ltd. I can expect a two week build time. At six hours, per day; that means I am getting eighty four hours of enjoyment for $2-3 dollars per hour. If I really want to increase my build time, I'll purchase some am parts(usually etch).



I did make this point in my original post. If you are buying a kit to build rather than to stick in the stash then it is easy to justify from the hours of entertainment.

My situation is that I probably have about 20 kits in my stash, there are still more that I would like to buy but the price is starting to deter me.

So it's not that I'm giving up just that not adding to the stash.

BTW, $50 is about entry price for Tamiyas and Dragons in the UK.

Cheers,

Nigel
retiredyank
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 08:54 AM UTC
Really? I source some of my orders from the UK, because they are cheaper. For a piece of etch and turned barrel, you get to pay $20 more. This is for a rebox of a kit from the 90s.
North4003
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 01:39 PM UTC
I look to buy bargains in the particular subject I'm interested in. My ouch point is $25 US. My LHS stocks older kits which I'm more than happy to build. My last purchase was a Italeri 1/72 Airplane for $12. I haven't spent much this past year; instead I'm more content building what I have. The Kit Maker Network has been a great motivation to get me to take the models out of the cupboard and assemble them.
SDavies
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 07:17 PM UTC
I know what you mean about being priced out, the vast majority of us have far less disposable income because of wage freezes and inflation and you have to seriously consider if a particular kit is worth £50. I have ruled out purchasing some of the most modern Dragon kits because they do not represent value for money in my opinion.

I have come to the conclusion that the best way for me to model is to super detail, I spend between 6/12/14 months on each model although I also spend £100's on after market upgrade parts so I am probably not saving much money.

S
WARDUKWNZ
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Posted: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 - 11:05 PM UTC
Nigel,,,Trust me i know exactly what you mean ... here in NZ land the prices for new kits is nuts to say the least ,, average price for a kit here ( DML,Bronco,Trumpeter ) is starting around the $75 mark and up ,, the Dragon M16 half track was priced at the $110 mark and it was around $90nz for the M3 ..
One little trick i used to get the kits i want but cant afford is getting other people to get them for me as gifts or part payment for building models for them ,,if i didnt have this skill i would be well screwed now dew to the prices .
As the other guys have suggested try playing with your models more ..paint..details and so on ..oh and also hunt for specials ..man those can save ya a fortune ,,as the old saying says..the more you hunt the more you find

Phill
nheather
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 12:27 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Really? I source some of my orders from the UK, because they are cheaper.



I have had my share of bargains in the UK but it is the case of being in the right place at the right time - and buying a kit that you like but probably wouldn't have been in your top 10. I've had a few eBay deals but I lose the majority when other bidders pay silly money.

But as a general rule if you want the latest Tamiya or Dragon you have to budget for £35 to £50 ($53 to $75).

Don't forget that in the UK we pay 20% sales tax (we call it VAT) on all purchases including online. When you buy from the UK you don't pay the 20% VAT so you will immediately see UK prices as 20% cheaper than we do.

Cheers,

Nigel
ludwig113
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 01:06 AM UTC
you could always sell some of the stash that wont be built and re-invest in current kits you like...i do this every now and again.
retiredyank
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 03:46 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Really? I source some of my orders from the UK, because they are cheaper.



I have had my share of bargains in the UK but it is the case of being in the right place at the right time - and buying a kit that you like but probably wouldn't have been in your top 10. I've had a few eBay deals but I lose the majority when other bidders pay silly money.

But as a general rule if you want the latest Tamiya or Dragon you have to budget for £35 to £50 ($53 to $75).

Don't forget that in the UK we pay 20% sales tax (we call it VAT) on all purchases including online. When you buy from the UK you don't pay the 20% VAT so you will immediately see UK prices as 20% cheaper than we do.

Cheers,

Nigel



I had forgot to factor that in.
spacewolfdad
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 07:46 AM UTC
Hi,

I see you are talking about 1/35 mainly, but the same applies to us Braille modellers. We have seen Dragon jack up their prices on new kits (which are basically their ready-built series in kit form) to over £20, other manufacturers are following suit. Why this should be so I haven't a clue, perhaps someone with a grasp of current economic thinking in these areas could explain the logic of charging excessive amounts for very little. As we all have far more in our stashes than we could ever realistically build, I think that I shall certainly be whittling mine down over the next few years. I will only buy something I KNOW I want to build and not buy because it is a 'nice' kit. I tend to buy more aftermarket as well now so I can detail what kits I have to a better standard. I find this more cost effective as the time spent making the kit is increased and thus becomes better value for money .

All the best,

Paul
russamotto
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 07:59 AM UTC
I find myself watching the price more and more. I have passed on kits I really wanted because they were out of my price range, but I have also experimented some because of kits that were affordable, such as the Zvezda BF-109 (airplane, I know, but inexpensive and full of detail) and also rebuilds of kits I enjoy, such as the AFV Club WC51. I like Japanese WWII armor, but the prices on those kits are outrageous. I spend a lot of time price hunting online (there aren't any local stores anymore) and waiting to buy new kits, and budged carefully.
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 08:18 AM UTC
I suspect you will find that with wages playing catch up in China, prices will continue to increase until wages stabilise in China or manufacturing moves to a cheaper labour force location.
raypalmer
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Posted: Wednesday, July 03, 2013 - 01:03 PM UTC
I think that we sometimes lose sight of how inexpensive this hobby really is. Golfists, boaters, anyone remotely interested in owning and operating a classic car...

We have it easy. I cannot fathom what some people spend on golfism. My boss is a mountain biking enthusiast, good great glory he spends ten fold what I do annually on that hobby. Growing up we had an old, modest sloop. A real proletarian sailboat. It cost a fortune to keep up and it was only a going concern for half of the year.

I can appreciate that it would be nicer if kits were cheaper. But then, kits keep getting better too. So it's not as if we're just paying more and not getting more.

Napkin origami and collecting uninteresting pinecones are free hobbies. But scale modelling is still a cheap one. By and large.
firstcircle
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Posted: Thursday, July 04, 2013 - 12:06 AM UTC
I agree with that actually... it only really starts to get close to seriously expensive if you want to "have it all", like every new book, kit, aftermarket part and finishing accessory that comes on to the market - and even then as Richard's point, it's nowhere near the amount folks spend on things like motorbikes - £10,000 for a new one every two or three years? I expect there are people around with every Dragon release of the last ten years sitting in their garages who might be getting somewhere near that kind of expenditure...

I'm not sure it's got so much to do with increasing wages in China either, I think it's more to do with what I said about it becoming a hobby for those with disposable incomes rather than kid's toys, which is more or less how it started out, and hence the costs are what the makers think the market will bear.
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