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Standard Issue Weapons?
Leopold
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Singapore / 新加坡
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Posted: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 - 11:27 PM UTC
that was the SAR 21... a similar desgin as the AUG
Vihuri
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Posted: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 - 03:10 AM UTC
Update on ADF's weapons:
The F88 comes in 4 versions-
F88 - standard issue
F88C - carbine version
F88S - has a piccaninny(spelling) style sight rail that enables an aftermarket sight or Night Weapon Sight (NWS) to be fitted.
F88GLA - standard issue F88 with a 40mm grenade launcher fitted under the barrel.

4-Eyes71
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 12:30 PM UTC

Quoted Text

hi,
over here in the uk, the standards are the SA80 a2 (had a lot of bad press but usually from those that dont use it), LSW, gpmg, l98 sniper rifle, browning pistol and various mortars and anti tank weapons.
Martin



You still call your rifle the SA-80. But how come others like calling it the L85 or Individual Weapon? When did you phase out your Self-loading rifles (FN FAL's)?

Is the L98 different from the AWP/AWM sniper rifle?
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 12:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text

In your country, what is the standard weapons used there by infantry?
Here in the Philippines, I think we used the M16 the most followed by the M14. Thanks



You also forgot that for sidearms, we still use the venerable old .45 caliber pistol usually issued to officers and to a few EP's (if their mission orders require it).
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 12:34 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Standard rifle for the ADF is the F88 Austyer with the F89 Minimi as the LSW.

Cheers,
Linz



G'day.

Austyer. You mean the Steyr Aug bullpup assault rifle? Is the F89 similar to the US M249 SAW?
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 12:43 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Back home (Israel) we mainly used M16 and Glilon (and Israeli version of the ak-47 and M16 safety). prior to that we used the infamous Uzi.

For more and accurate info you can check http://www.isayeret.com



Whatever happened to your Galil? That rifle is also very popular here at some of our army officers here adopt it as their personal weapon over the standard M16. What does the Glilon look like? I haven't seen one yet though I have seen a Galil. I also noticed (based on news footages) Israeli soldiers using M-16's and a few M4's more. I hardly see anyone using Galils.

Why did you call the Uzi infamous? It's a very popular SMG alongside the HK MP5.

Does the IDF still use the Jericho for a sidearm? Some of our policemen use that too.
shonen_red
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 03:39 PM UTC

Quoted Text

You still call your rifle the SA-80. But how come others like calling it the L85 or Individual Weapon? When did you phase out your Self-loading rifles (FN FAL's)?

Is the L98 different from the AWP/AWM sniper rifle?



The SA-80 is also the Einfield L85? (I'm not sure about the nubmer but it has the "Einfield L" in it)

As for the L98, by the looks and specs, I think it is commonly known as AWP/AWM. Pretty much the same as they would call the M1 "Garand".

FN's are phased out? They look pretty neat especially the P90 :-). I forgot the name of the other one I like but it is somewhat a hybrid of P90 and Aug, FN 2000 I think.

My .02 cents
greatbrit
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 08:02 PM UTC
SA80=small arm for the 80's, the original project name.

L85=the designation of the standard production weapon

L98=the designation of the cadet training version, not capable of automatic fire

individual weapon was also a name given to it in its early days.

the SLR, which is different to the FN FAL, was starting to be replaced from the late 80's onwards. however they were still in pretty widespread service during desert storm, but were almost completely replaced by the L85 soon afterwards.many regiments still have large stocks of them even now.

the L85A1, is the latest version, it is the HK modified one, in response to poor performance of the L85. the main distinguishing feature is the bolt handle. on the L85 its a small round one, on the A1 its sort of a curved plastic thing.

the L98 has a large pivoting bolt handle, almost exactly the same as an M2 .50 cal

hope that clears it up,

cheers

joe
greatbrit
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Posted: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 08:23 PM UTC


L85A1, note the curved plastic bolt handle



L98, note the large bolt handle, and long external operating rod behind it



heres the original L85. note the small round bolt handle

a picture says a thousand words

cheers

joe
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Friday, March 12, 2004 - 12:19 AM UTC

Quoted Text

SA80=small arm for the 80's, the original project name.

L85=the designation of the standard production weapon

L98=the designation of the cadet training version, not capable of automatic fire

individual weapon was also a name given to it in its early days.

the SLR, which is different to the FN FAL, was starting to be replaced from the late 80's onwards. however they were still in pretty widespread service during desert storm, but were almost completely replaced by the L85 soon afterwards.many regiments still have large stocks of them even now.

the L85A1, is the latest version, it is the HK modified one, in response to poor performance of the L85. the main distinguishing feature is the bolt handle. on the L85 its a small round one, on the A1 its sort of a curved plastic thing.

the L98 has a large pivoting bolt handle, almost exactly the same as an M2 .50 cal

hope that clears it up,

cheers

joe



Thanks, Joe/Greatbrit.

One more question. How come some units do not have the SUSAT system in their rifles? Are they limited to first-line units only?

Do some units in the British armed forces still use the M-16?
greatbrit
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Posted: Friday, March 12, 2004 - 12:23 AM UTC

Quoted Text




One more question. How come some units do not have the SUSAT system in their rifles? Are they limited to first-line units only?

Do some units in the British armed forces still use the M-16?



susats are mainly issued to front line infantry etc units only, as they are very expensive!

its suposedly the best standard issue sight in the world, but they cost too much to give to every soldier.

the M16 is still used by special forces, SAS/SBS etc, and some airborne pathfinder units.

RM commandos may also use some but im not sure

cheers

joe
mikeli125
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Posted: Friday, March 12, 2004 - 05:59 AM UTC
some RCT units such as the old 10 Reg were issued them due to the fact that they were supllying fromt line troops, also as well as the cost we have more things to bang it against and break it with hence why we get Iron sights, Any way they couldnt understand why the grunts were getting sea sick on the indoor simulaters (biggest shoot-em up I 've played!)
turns out that looking through the sights onto the screen whilst they were moving was causing therm to get montion sickness
greatbrit
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Posted: Friday, March 12, 2004 - 07:55 PM UTC
do you mean the SAT ranges mike?

i hated the bloody things. even looking through iron sights they made me dizzy!

cheers

joe
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Saturday, March 13, 2004 - 01:17 PM UTC

Quoted Text

do you mean the SAT ranges mike?

i hated the bloody things. even looking through iron sights they made me dizzy!

cheers

joe



Forgive me if I sound naive, but it's amazing that the British army has a simulator for combat situations. I take it you use wax bullets when shooting at screens, do you?

Going back to the assault rifle issue. How come your SOF's prefer using the M-16 instead of the L85 considering the latter is locally made hence readily available to armed forces personnel.
greatbrit
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Posted: Sunday, March 14, 2004 - 05:56 AM UTC
yes they do use simulators.

they are called SAT ranges, (small or simulated arms trainers, i cant remember which)

the are like a 25m range set up, with a screen at the end. you use a modified L85, with a compressed air recoil simulator replacing the working parts, and a laser emitter in the barrel.

you shoot at targets on the screen, either range targets, or simulated enemy troops. a computer charts your activity.

not being in the armed forces, ive only used it once, but it was fun, but nausiating!

i think our special forces prefer the M16 for its reliability.

the L85 has an atrocious reputation, but i may be wrong

cheers

joe
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Sunday, March 14, 2004 - 11:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text



not being in the armed forces, ive only used it once, but it was fun, but nausiating!



Why do you say it's nauseating?


Quoted Text

i think our special forces prefer the M16 for its reliability.

the L85 has an atrocious reputation, but i may be wrong



I think special forces troops around the world are very picky and meticulous on the kind of weapons they would like to use and they want nothing more than the best yet most reliable weapons.

BTW, what do British armed forces personnel use for sidearms? Is the Browning phased out for a double-action pistol?
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Sunday, March 14, 2004 - 11:55 AM UTC

Quoted Text


and as for still having lewis guns well in 1994 my unit still had the bren/lmg think we were
the last unit to still have them and stirling smgs
I've seen some picutes of the usmc using gpmgs why is this do they think it's a better weapon than the m60?
:-) :-)



You still use those Great War-era Lewis Guns? The same with the Bren?

As for the GPMG (the Americans call it the M240), it is gradually replacing the the M60 as their main "heavy" (medium is a better word) machine gun. From what I read about it, the barrels of the M60 is giving them headaches. Both the M249 SAW and the M240 GPMG are both based on the FN models. I think the USMC (even the US Army Rangers) is after quality and they consider the FN family of MG's better than the locally-made M60. Both these weapons are modified with a Picatinny rail to allow them to mount a variety of sighting devices.
greatbrit
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Posted: Monday, March 15, 2004 - 12:22 AM UTC
hey eyes,

the SAT range made me feel dizzy, its a bit like sitting to close to a tv.

the standard issue sidearm is the 9mm browning hp. same as it has been since mid WW2.

RAF aircrews used to carry PPKs for self defense, but these have now been replaced by glocks.

many units still have large numbers of WW2 weapons in storage, and some WW1 guns are still out there, although not on general issue.

brens, No4 enfields and SMLE's can be found in most armouries,

cheers

joe
4-Eyes71
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Posted: Monday, March 15, 2004 - 12:00 PM UTC

Quoted Text

hey eyes,
the SAT range made me feel dizzy, its a bit like sitting to close to a tv.
the standard issue sidearm is the 9mm browning hp. same as it has been since mid WW2.
RAF aircrews used to carry PPKs for self defense, but these have now been replaced by glocks.
many units still have large numbers of WW2 weapons in storage, and some WW1 guns are still out there, although not on general issue.
brens, No4 enfields and SMLE's can be found in most armouries,
cheers
joe



Hi, Joe:

I wonder what is it about the Browning (I take it it's the FN version, not the US version, is it?) that makes it stay longer in the holsters of your armed forces? Most other countries are switching to double-action pistols

But you know, here in my country, our armed forces still use the .45 automatic for a sidearm. Only our police forces use 9mm pistols.

It's amazing that your still use WWI-era weapons up to now. You must have really taken good care of them. I take it they can still manufacture parts for Lewis Guns and Brens to keep it functioning.

WW2-era weapons here are only used by local militia and paramilitary units here.
mikeli125
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Posted: Monday, March 15, 2004 - 10:52 PM UTC
browning pistols are still in use cant see them being replaced any time soon Brens ect are are no longer used even the ones re-chambered to 7.62 and will mostly be show pieces or used for a bit of training not many people will be trained in the use of them as for the enfields these will most likely be "DP" drill purpose which means they have been altered so they cant fire again these may be used for combat swimming tests were you enter the water with webbing and weapons (sa80 would be rusty by the time you came out the other end)! but more now you will see the old SLR being used for this purpose you can find AK's ect in the armouries as well brought back as war trophies and used for training
thenamshow
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Posted: Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 11:29 AM UTC
we use the M16A2 for standard use in the army, but our seals use the very well known M4A1 assult rifle.
mondo
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Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 - 12:57 AM UTC

Quoted Text



L85A1, note the curved plastic bolt handle



L98, note the large bolt handle, and long external operating rod behind it



heres the original L85. note the small round bolt handle

a picture says a thousand words

cheers

joe





Rifles with magazines mounted behind the grip always seem awkward for left handed guys like me. I understand that the Austrian Steyr can be tactically adjusted if the user is left handed so that cartridges does not discharge to his face. The SA80 and the French FAMAS would be a real disappointment for me. The way it looks, if I use SA80. I might burn my face and scratch it off from the blowback of the bolt handle. Or am I wrong? I have not actually seen one in the "flesh" so I can only imagine. Not to mention the fumes. When I fired the M16 I had to use a kercheif so I don't smell it so much.
mikeli125
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Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 - 06:01 AM UTC
Mondo,
I use the SA-80 and I'm left handed you wont burn your face I've never noticed
any problems shooting as I always use my right eye you cant smell the fumes either
just been firing them for 2 weeks on the trot now with 2 very minor stopages due to
the empty casing getting stuck on its rim on it's way out
erwinrommel
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Posted: Saturday, May 01, 2004 - 03:23 PM UTC
as a scout sniper i use a modified m4a1 the aug is rarley used by the sas in australia we dont like em!
the m82 and m95 rifles are some of my all time favorutes because of their shear power and superiority over anything out there i just love it
The m60 is an oldie but a goodie the m60 is a great gun all round not as extensivley used as it was in name but we still use it and its as good as the minimi or saw.
CACMAN
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Posted: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 - 09:12 PM UTC

Quoted Text



, with a compressed air recoil simulator replacing the working parts, and a laser emitter in the barrel.




and a really nasty NCO will tell you that the recoil is "exactly like it is out on the the Ranges", we soon learned different.....its not an awfall lot but certaily diferent from the SAT ranges.....