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German tank changing the war?
hellbent11
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Posted: Thursday, April 06, 2006 - 11:08 AM UTC
Just curious. Which German tank that actually saw service could have been a factor in changing the outcome of the war not taking into account any other factors like tactics and other weapon systems?

MY TWO CENTS: Panzer IV & variants. Less cost and a good match for the Sherman. (If produced in quantity)
Halfyank
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Posted: Thursday, April 06, 2006 - 07:38 PM UTC
A while back we had a thread on Quantity vs Quality. Pz IV in great numbers would certainly have helped a bit, but of course they didn't just have to fight the Sherman, they also had to fight the Russian tanks. I'm not sure that the Pz IV would do as well against them. If I had to say one tank I'd go with a LOT more Panthers.

blaster76
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Posted: Friday, April 07, 2006 - 05:54 AM UTC
I concur with Rodger. If they had fielded the Panther say 4 or 5 months earlier , made a 1,000 + more of them it definitely would have caused a longer time in achieving final victory. It would not have changed the final outcome of the war the Germans couldn't make babies grow into full grown men any faster.
MonkeyGun
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Posted: Friday, April 07, 2006 - 06:48 AM UTC
I agree on more Panther's probably the best "medium" tank of WW2 , but as Steve pointed out , you could have the best tank out there but you still need highly trained / experienced crews to use the vehicle effectively.


Ian
hellbent11
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Posted: Friday, April 07, 2006 - 10:22 AM UTC
You all make a good point! I was thinking more along the lines of supply and logistics problems as well as difficulty to maintain and produce. I've heard several times that Germany could produce nearly two Panzer IV's for what one Panther cost. Do you all know if this is really a fact or just a figure of speech? I admit that I hadn't taken into account any of the Russian heavy stuff which is an excellent point!
Hohenstaufen
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Posted: Friday, April 07, 2006 - 04:17 PM UTC
I'm not sure that any German tank actually had any real influence on WW2.
If you look at the current German Leopard, it could be argued that no WW2 German tank had any real influence on tank design either, Leopard owes more to British & American designs than anything else. The only influence was in a vague sense in increased weapons capability & armour.
But the only German tank that can really be said to have any influence was the Tiger, in that even individual tanks could shape battles (as at Villers Bocage). But even the Tiger was a developmental dead end.
The Panther was potentially perhaps a better tank, but they took almost as long to build as Tigers, certainly longer than a PzIV. It might have been interesting if the Germans had produced masses of PanzerJager IV Lang, with the L70 Panther gun. They could have really churned them out, & in a defensive position, they could knock out anything the Allies had.
spooky6
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Posted: Saturday, April 08, 2006 - 09:07 PM UTC
I doubt any land weapon could have changed the outcome of WW2. If any, it would have been artillery, and specifically the ballistic V2 system.