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Modeling in General: AMPS
Topics about AMPS (Armor Model and Preservation Society).
AMPS: How do I get my membership fee back?
MLD
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Posted: Friday, December 16, 2005 - 09:22 PM UTC
I'll post here since I see that the current pres (Paul, right? Sorry , I forget your name and since I haven't seen a boresite in 6+months, I can't check there) occasionally reads and posts.

And since the website has a tiny headline telling members not to log in due to server issues, I cannot air this laundry in it's proper forum.

Simply stated, I'd like my membership fee returned.

I started asking about missing boresites in early October (the 2nd to be exact), found my membership had lapsed and I had missed getting the reminder card.
I paid my membership fee via paypal, and heard that all current issues and the back issues I missed were on the way.

Now it's December 17th, 2 and 1/2 months later, and I've gotten nothing for my membership.

I have spoken with another local member who was promised backissues and never recieved them.

I know we're a member-run organization, but even so this level of service is unacceptable to me.

I'd like my money back now please.

Post to this thread or PM me, either way, I'd like my fee returned

Thanks but no thanks
Mike
Javlin813
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Posted: Friday, December 16, 2005 - 11:44 PM UTC
I've had my fair share of dissatisfaction with AMPS as well. Late or missing Boresights, etc. But they have always answered my emails (not necessarily as timely as I might have liked but the did get back to me.)

You can log in to their site if you are already registered with the site. I would suggest that you send them another email and explain exactly what is going on.

Good luck! If this still doesn't solve your problem, let me know and I'll send them a note and we'll see if that works

Scott
GunTruck
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Posted: Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 03:49 AM UTC
I've also forward your comments via e-mail. I believe you will get a response to clear these issues up - I used the e-mail listed on your Profile Page for them to respond to you.

I apologize on behalf of the Executive for your Membership Issues and hope they get clear up quickly.

Gunnie
MLD
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Posted: Sunday, December 18, 2005 - 05:05 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I've had my fair share of dissatisfaction with AMPS as well. Late or missing Boresights, etc. But they have always answered my emails (not necessarily as timely as I might have liked but the did get back to me.)

You can log in to their site if you are already registered with the site. I would suggest that you send them another email and explain exactly what is going on.

Good luck! If this still doesn't solve your problem, let me know and I'll send them a note and we'll see if that works

Scott



Scott,
Thanks for posting.

Tried that, got a post up there as well, who's gotten a Boresite in New England and I sent basically the same message via their "contact us" link.
Still no reply, still no paypal refund.

But on the other hand 145 people (+- the folks who've read this twice) have read it here.

I thought about being a jerk and posting this same message to all the modeling boards ,but I decided that would be spiteful and vindictive.
I'm not trying to make AMPS look bad, I'm just sick of waiting and want my money back.

Mike
Moezilla
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Posted: Sunday, December 18, 2005 - 09:29 PM UTC
If they're having problems getting the magazine out to their members, I guess non-members who requested a sample copy won't be getting their either. I requested one a little while ago, wanted to check out the club and magazine myself. Is this an ongoing issue or just a problem they're having now? Any other input on this club?
MLD
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 12:20 AM UTC
I'm probably the wrong person to ask.

Generally the magazine is pretty good, each issue contains a mixture of reviews, research articles, show results. All the articles are member contributions and are of pretty high quality. It is not as slickly publishes as FSM or MMIR, but is worth getting.

But like the IPMS Journal, with the advent of the internet the published reviews are not as timely as you'll find online.

Mike
cfbush2000
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 02:00 AM UTC
I joined to get access to FMJ. However, I can't log into the AMPS website. And several e-mails (6 - either get a generated password response or none at all.
I've gotten the mags (and they are ok), but after nearly 6 months of trying, I still can't get into the website.
Chuck
tankmodeler
#417
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 10:50 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I'll post here since I see that the current pres (Paul, right? Sorry , I forget your name and since I haven't seen a boresite in 6+months, I can't check there) occasionally reads and posts.



Mike,

Jim Lewis passed your message on to me. First, please let me apologize for us not responding. This is the first I've heard of things going awry, but I'll make them up ASAP. I guarantee it.


Quoted Text

And since the website has a tiny headline telling members not to log in due to server issues, I cannot air this laundry in it's proper forum.


I appreciate that and understand how having the site down is an inconvenience. It is back up now and we are rolling out the new design.

[quoteSimply stated, I'd like my membership fee returned.[/quote]
I hope I can talk you out of this, but if that's what it takes, it will be returned.


Quoted Text

]I started asking about missing boresites in early October (the 2nd to be exact), found my membership had lapsed and I had missed getting the reminder card.
I paid my membership fee via paypal, and heard that all current issues and the back issues I missed were on the way.

Now it's December 17th, 2 and 1/2 months later, and I've gotten nothing for my membership.


We have only recently sent out the Nov/Dec issue, so if your membership lapsed in October, that should be the only one you are missing. Did you get the Sept/Oct issue? Can you let me know when it lapsed?


Quoted Text

I have spoken with another local member who was promised backissues and never recieved them.



Please have him email me and I'll make it right. I'm at:
[email protected] (replace the "dot" with ".")


Quoted Text

I know we're a member-run organization, but even so this level of service is unacceptable to me.



It's unacceptable to me as well. Please let me know, offline, what address you were corresponding with.


Quoted Text

I'd like my money back now please.


If you still want that, then it's yours.

While I can't comment on this without knowng the details, we do try to get back to members ASAP and to sort out any problems as quickly. It seems that this has fallen through some cracks, but I'll make it right, whichever way you want it.

As I said, contact me at my home address, above, let me know the details and I'll get the ball rolling.

Paul Roberts
President
Armor Modeling and Preservation Society
tankmodeler
#417
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 10:58 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I joined to get access to FMJ. However, I can't log into the AMPS website. And several e-mails (6 - either get a generated password response or none at all.
I've gotten the mags (and they are ok), but after nearly 6 months of trying, I still can't get into the website.
Chuck



Chuck,

As I emailed to you in November, the site was down and no-one was getting access until it was fixed and running again. The new web site is now up and running and we are populating the FMJ area again. It currently has only a few of the photos available, but once your password is in place and you can see those few, the rest will be available as we link them to the new site, a process that should be complete by New Years.

Everyone will have to email in and get their password revalidated. Please go to the site and follow the instructions and you will be revalidated within a day. Please also email me at home to let me know you've done it and I'll make sure your login is processed as quickly as possible.

My home address is:

[email protected] (replace the "dot" with ".")

This has been a trying time for us in the executive as well as you, our members, and I really want to apologise for the hassle and inconvenience this has caused. We have been fighting a bit of a dragon with this one and have had to do a major rework to get back on track, I hope that you will all like the new features that will be rolled out as soon as we have the basic site up back in first class shape again.

Paul Roberts
President
Armor Modeling and Preservation Society
tankmodeler
#417
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 11:04 AM UTC

Quoted Text

If they're having problems getting the magazine out to their members, I guess non-members who requested a sample copy won't be getting their either. I requested one a little while ago, wanted to check out the club and magazine myself. Is this an ongoing issue or just a problem they're having now? Any other input on this club?



Maurice,

If you will email me at home, I will personally find out what happened to your sample magazine. If it was ordered throught the site over the last couple of months, then it probably evaporated in cyberspace given the problems we have been having with the site. However, things are back on track now so a request should get you your mags quickly. Still, to be safe, let me know directly at my address, below and I'll make sure the postmaster gets them out right away.

Generally our publishing schedule has been fairly consistent, but I must say we have run a bit late a couple times in the last 2 years. We try not to make a habit of this, but occasionally real life interferes with the running fot eh magazine and we are late. Certainly every member gets his full 6 issues per year, even if we have run late on an issue.

My address is:

[email protected] (replace the "dot" with ".")

Regards,

Paul Roberts
President
Armor Modeling and Preservation Society
salt6
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 06:29 PM UTC
Next time just file a complaint with paypal. That will get a vendors attention very fast.
tankmodeler
#417
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 10:56 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Next time just file a complaint with paypal. That will get a vendors attention very fast.


Without trying to be flippant or dismissive and acknowledging that we, as an organisation, never want to have a complaint filed against us with any group by any member, actually complaining to Paypal will revice the same attantion any other complaint will get because it will be the same people actioning things. We are a very small executive running the organisation and, while we hope to get to everything as soon as possible, occasionally things go wrong.

Remember, we are not a "vendor". We make no profit nor do we have an office or a paid staff. We are modelers like you who are trying to offer a club and some )hopefully) useful and neat services to other modelers.

As members you have a right to expect services to be provided, I just hope you will moderate your expectations to match the capabilities of an organisation run, essentially, by 10 people in their spare time.

Filing complaints against the club is entirely appropriate if we are withholding services or funds or other fraudulant/inappropriate conduct, but I think we all hope that it never has to come to that. As soon as I heard abut Mike's issues, I responded. I will continue to work with him to make sure he is satisfied, one way or the other. The same goes for Maurice and Chuck. I give them and you my word on it and I will not quit until they have recieved satisfactory service.

This not meant to be a whining reply to a legitimate issue. I know we, and I, are not perfect and we occasionally drop the ball. I just want you all to know that if I know about the problem, I am in your corner to get it fixed. I am elected by the members and I am their servant when it comes to getting things done. It may be trite but I really do take Harry Truman's desk plaque seriously. I'm the President of the organisation and the buck really does stop here.

Paul
Moezilla
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Posted: Monday, December 19, 2005 - 11:08 PM UTC
Thanks for your responses here Paul, they are very appreciated. I sent you an e-mail this morning as you requested, I do appreciate you taking the time to look into my request. Mine is not as important as the members are, so they take priority and I will wait my turn in line. Once again, thanks for taking the time to address this publicly with everyone Paul!
salt6
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Posted: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 07:11 AM UTC
It worked. It got your attention didn't it.
tankmodeler
#417
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Posted: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 07:33 PM UTC

Quoted Text

It worked. It got your attention didn't it.


Well, my attention was gotten as soon as Jim Lewis passed on the fact that Mike had posted his complaint. I had not heard of this before. I never want things to get to the point that a complaint is filed with another organisation. Not because complaining to Paypal is important, but because i want to offer better service to members so that it's not at all necessary.

Paul
MLD
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Posted: Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 01:54 AM UTC
I am not going to "go after" an organization I've been a part of for 6 (??)years now and that overall believe in through paypal for the return of a small membership fee.

From my point of view in all my dealings with AMPS over the past years, Paul has been a stand up guy and the voice of reason when all about him have been chucking stones.
He's sufferend the stones with grace and class, never once (as far as I've seen) stooped to pick one up to throw back.
He's stepped up and taken responsibility for things that are not his fault or were not his responsibility and for that I respect him.

I started this thread to get a refund, since other channels did not seem to be working.

I've got no agenda and am not trying to drag the organization through the mud.

Mike
Moezilla
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Posted: Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 03:11 AM UTC
Not being affiliated with the club I posted here regarding my request for a sample boresight so I could check out the club. Paul has gone out of his way to look into this for me to get it taken care of, so in my first dealing with Paul I have to say he is a standup guy that does his best for this organization. It's easy to throw stones, unfortunately not all the time is the praise thrown out there as easily. I thank Paul for explaining the situation with the website and how requests for samples were lost and in getting involved with this situation as well as (and more importantly) MLD's, who IS a member of this club.

Thanks Paul!
tankmodeler
#417
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Posted: Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 06:14 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I've got no agenda and am not trying to drag the organization through the mud.



Mike,

I appreciate your point and had no thoughts that you had any kind of agenda. While I hope I can convince you remain a member, I'll get you your refund if I fail in that. No problem.

Mike and Maurice,

Thanks for the kind words. I really appreciate them, but it's not why I try to be a "stand up guy". I do it because that's what I would expect. I try to be part of the "do unto others" school of ethics.

Steve B,
I also don't think you were trying to get on my case. Yours was a fair enough comment, I was just trying to show that in some cases (like this one) it doesn't matter who is pounding on the door or what door they pound on, the same couple of schmucks are the only ones available to answer it. In this case, I just happen to be the head schmuck. :-)

And, for anyone out there who hasn't seen a Boresight magazine and is wondering what we're all on about, feel free to send me your snail mail address and we'll get a free sample copy out to you right after Christmas.

Best regards to all,

Paul
salt6
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Posted: Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 09:29 AM UTC
Paul,

As I said going to paypal is only one way to get a vendors attention.
cfbush2000
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Posted: Friday, December 23, 2005 - 10:50 PM UTC
Thanks to Paul for the help. I am now logged in at the website.

Chuck
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