I'm going to try my first wash and I keep hearing that you need to put a gloss coat on first. Now I'd like to avoid a gloss coat if possible for a number of reasons ( clear gloss and clear flat coats ruin the paint when I brush it on, it is yet another expense that I don't have money for). So I was wondering if it is possible to put an oil wash on a flat acrylic base or will that mess up my model. My concern is that the flat acrylic will "soak up" the wash rather then let it flow into the seems.
Any help would be appreciated.
Hosted by Jim Starkweather
Oil base wash on flat acrylic?
Thiazi
Member Since: February 03, 2005
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 05:09 AM UTC
Ripster
Member Since: June 01, 2005
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 05:13 AM UTC
Try testing it out on a scrap piece first. I've certainly put oil washes straight onto enamels and acrylics and it has worked out fine. However, ymmv which is why I recommend a test run first!
AJLaFleche
Member Since: May 05, 2002
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 05:25 AM UTC
First, neber brush these coats on. If you don't have an , airbrush, use a spray can.
Second, when applying a wash, avoid covering the whole kit then wiping the excess off. That's a great way to ruin a paint job, Place teh wash where you want shadows/emphasis, such as panel lines, at the base of bolts and raised detail, etc. Dab it, rather than brushing it. Capillary action wil pull it along. True, this works better on a glossy surface, but it's not required.
Third, if you're applying water slilde decals, you need to gloss and flat coat your military models. Decals have carrier film which will silver on flat paint (Which actually has a rough surface and will allow air to be trapped inthe bumps, while gloss is smooth and not allow this to happen) Most decals are glossy and will really look poor agains a flat surface.
Second, when applying a wash, avoid covering the whole kit then wiping the excess off. That's a great way to ruin a paint job, Place teh wash where you want shadows/emphasis, such as panel lines, at the base of bolts and raised detail, etc. Dab it, rather than brushing it. Capillary action wil pull it along. True, this works better on a glossy surface, but it's not required.
Third, if you're applying water slilde decals, you need to gloss and flat coat your military models. Decals have carrier film which will silver on flat paint (Which actually has a rough surface and will allow air to be trapped inthe bumps, while gloss is smooth and not allow this to happen) Most decals are glossy and will really look poor agains a flat surface.
Gunny
Member Since: July 13, 2004
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 06:58 AM UTC
Greetings, Thiazi!
I myself have been experimenting with acrylic washes, and having great results! I have been mixing them about 6 to 1 (water to paint) with just a drop of clear liquid soap to help the flow, and using this mix as you would an oil wash...really depends on what brand of acrylic paint that you start with, as some brands are thicker than others...I have been using standard artists acrylics mixed in this formulation, and achieving a fine end product, with no harm to the original finish...but before I wash, I always coat the model with Future floor wax, (which will bring the gloss up), so if you don't want to final spray your model when complete (but it is highly reccomended, to protect the finish!) then I would test this method out somewhere on the piece that might not be noticable...never tried it without the Future, though, so I don't know if it will work well or not..
Gunny
I myself have been experimenting with acrylic washes, and having great results! I have been mixing them about 6 to 1 (water to paint) with just a drop of clear liquid soap to help the flow, and using this mix as you would an oil wash...really depends on what brand of acrylic paint that you start with, as some brands are thicker than others...I have been using standard artists acrylics mixed in this formulation, and achieving a fine end product, with no harm to the original finish...but before I wash, I always coat the model with Future floor wax, (which will bring the gloss up), so if you don't want to final spray your model when complete (but it is highly reccomended, to protect the finish!) then I would test this method out somewhere on the piece that might not be noticable...never tried it without the Future, though, so I don't know if it will work well or not..
Gunny
Thiazi
Member Since: February 03, 2005
entire network: 66 Posts
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 09:35 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I myself have been experimenting with acrylic washes, and having great results! I have been mixing them about 6 to 1 (water to paint) with just a drop of clear liquid soap to help the flow, and using this mix as you would an oil wash
I actually tested this method before I settled on oil based washes because due to my inexperience I ended up with a streaky residue and ugly splotches. Now I was using Tamiya acrylics so that might explain it.
warthog
Member Since: July 29, 2002
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 10:42 AM UTC
Quoted Text
actually tested this method before I settled on oil based washes because due to my inexperience I ended up with a streaky residue and ugly splotches. Now I was using Tamiya acrylics so that might explain it.
Hi Thiazi,
I second AJLaFleche's reply. BTW, have you considered that those streaks that you exprienced can be used as part of weathering? You can use them to simulate rain/water marks....just my 2cents...
Cheers
warthog
Member Since: July 29, 2002
entire network: 1,460 Posts
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 10:42 AM UTC
Quoted Text
actually tested this method before I settled on oil based washes because due to my inexperience I ended up with a streaky residue and ugly splotches. Now I was using Tamiya acrylics so that might explain it.
Hi Thiazi,
I second AJLaFleche's reply. BTW, have you considered that those streaks that you exprienced can be used as part of weathering? You can use them to simulate rain/water marks....just my 2cents...
Cheers
auburn
Member Since: January 18, 2005
entire network: 927 Posts
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 05:40 PM UTC
Hi cobber,.. please dont tell any one that u got this from a hardend figure bloke.....
youve painted your verhicle with acrylic,.. ok its dry..springkle talcum powder over your model and move it around with a soft brush,...then blow the excess off....a thin film will be left....then thin your oil paints 75% turps 25% pigment ( paint)...then load your brush with the wash and let it seep through the talcum powder done in a controled way, in and around nuts and bolts cracks etc., and in areas that would show ware and tare,..you can also blend edges any surface,.. looks neat for rust on both white and normal military colours.
Also talcum powder mixed with Van dyke brown and a little Prussian blue,.. makes great mud for a the backs of wheels and tank tracks, it takes on that dry grease look.....all above works on figures and in place of talcum powder one can use pastel powder.....I have not told u any of these tricks ok.....
have a go Phil
youve painted your verhicle with acrylic,.. ok its dry..springkle talcum powder over your model and move it around with a soft brush,...then blow the excess off....a thin film will be left....then thin your oil paints 75% turps 25% pigment ( paint)...then load your brush with the wash and let it seep through the talcum powder done in a controled way, in and around nuts and bolts cracks etc., and in areas that would show ware and tare,..you can also blend edges any surface,.. looks neat for rust on both white and normal military colours.
Also talcum powder mixed with Van dyke brown and a little Prussian blue,.. makes great mud for a the backs of wheels and tank tracks, it takes on that dry grease look.....all above works on figures and in place of talcum powder one can use pastel powder.....I have not told u any of these tricks ok.....
have a go Phil
auburn
Member Since: January 18, 2005
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Posted: Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 05:49 PM UTC
Sorry cobber , forgot to say by adding different oil colour washes u can blend and show colour changes, did this on a LRDG truck and willies jeep...was very happy..
Phil...
Phil...
Ross
Member Since: December 23, 2004
entire network: 213 Posts
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Posted: Friday, August 19, 2005 - 03:03 AM UTC
My two cents worth;
Tried an oil wash with real turps on top of vallejo acrylic and it melted through in places and ate through the plastic. I think I may have been a bit heavy handed and the turps was very top quality and concentrated. In future I will use a spray matt varnish and/or a water based wash. The problem with this is extended drying times.
Ross
Tried an oil wash with real turps on top of vallejo acrylic and it melted through in places and ate through the plastic. I think I may have been a bit heavy handed and the turps was very top quality and concentrated. In future I will use a spray matt varnish and/or a water based wash. The problem with this is extended drying times.
Ross
jpzr
Member Since: July 01, 2004
entire network: 316 Posts
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Posted: Friday, August 19, 2005 - 03:28 AM UTC
Quoted Text
My two cents worth;
Tried an oil wash with real turps on top of vallejo acrylic and it melted through in places and ate through the plastic. I think I may have been a bit heavy handed and the turps was very top quality and concentrated. In future I will use a spray matt varnish and/or a water based wash. The problem with this is extended drying times.
Ross
Have you tried artificial turpenoid (NOT natural turpenoid, or turpentine)? I find this stuff to be much milder than turpentine and I have had 0% negative interaction with any acrylic. It is just 'hot' enough to evenly thin the oils without interacting with the underlying paint (even well-cured enamels). Drys consistently as well. I'd suggest giving this a try before experimenting with acrylic and water/alcohol based washes (which I find FAR less forgiving than oil washes). The beauty of oil washes is their workability which, when used with artificial turpenoid (mineral, or white, spirits also work well), make them practically foolproof.
Racedriver25
Member Since: May 28, 2006
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Posted: Monday, May 29, 2006 - 04:17 AM UTC
They also now make or have made (just noticed them recently) acrylic based "oil" paints that you mix with water. I have not tried them yet but it should"nt harm anything- your paint job or the plastic.
05Sultan
#037
Member Since: December 19, 2004
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Posted: Monday, May 29, 2006 - 07:41 PM UTC
I would test on a seperate piece to be sure if you have had problems in the past.Generally,if the paint is well dried(3 days or more),you shouldn't have a problem with spirit washes,especially if you primed before your acrylics went on.Al is quite correct about the gloss/decal procedure.Do this before the wash.
Cheers!
Cheers!
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