Help - I'm stumped - My gravity feed single action Badger will not feed . I get air through it but even the lowest viscosity liquids - lacquer thinner , airbrush cleaner etc won't spray . Believe me when I say the brush is spotlessly clean inside and out - completely disassembled and soaked in solvents and several trips through my ultrasonic cleaner including changing the cleaner bath to fresh. All orifices are clear including the tip . It was working fine this morning then started acting up . Cleaning got it working again for a bit then would clog again - ultimately it will not spray no matter how clean it is . Any ideas ? Google searches and Badgers instructions only recommend what I have done several times .
Thanks in advance for any help - Richard
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Badger 200 G won't feed
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 06:31 AM UTC
PRH001
Member Since: June 16, 2014
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Posted: Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 08:28 AM UTC
Check to see if the Teflon washer is worn, or too flattened to properly seal. I’d also check the tip for being split.
Paul H
Paul H
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 09:58 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Check to see if the Teflon washer is worn, or too flattened to properly seal. I’d also check the tip for being split.
Paul H
Paul - thanks for the response. Unfortunately the washer didn't do it . I have a 200 siphon feed and a 150 siphon as well along with a fine head set for all . Swapping out components with the 200 brushes proved that the tips / washer aren't the problem as all components work with the siphon brush but not the gravity feed .
I am absolutely baffled by this as it is really such a simple machine . Badger has a great warranty program where , for the most part you simply send the brush to them with a check for $ 12. for return shipping . Never a charge for labor and rarely do they charge for parts so it's going back to them tomorrow. I'll post the results.
Richard
Kevlar06
Member Since: March 15, 2009
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Posted: Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 10:04 PM UTC
Richard-- I'm not totally familiar with the Badger 200, but I do have a Badger 155. Is the air getting past the trigger? On occasion I've found the spring, or rubber seals will gum up, blocking airflow, which doesn't allow enough air past the trigger, in turn not allowing enough air through to carry the paint. But it's good to check your hose or the compressor/air supply. I've found I often blame my airbrush for pressure problems originating "down the line" farther, only to discover it isn't the AB at all. I have three Airbrushes, a Badger 155 Anthem as mentioned, a Peak C5, and a Paasche Millenium. Strange thing is that I've had air pressure issues with all of them in the past-- where one or another doesn't spray properly or at all, but the other two work fine-- only to discover it was a pressure problem in the compressor. Last time, I discovered I had a pin-hole leak in my tank at the bottom (fixed with JB Weld by the way). My Badger and Paasche worked fine-- the Peak wouldn't work at all, there was just not enough pressure passing through the trigger mechanism.
VR, Russ
VR, Russ
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 11:16 PM UTC
Russ - Thanks for the response and the help . I have plenty of air through to the nozzle . Even the least viscous fluids simply will not flow out of the cup. The path from the cup to the nozzle is absolutely clear - it will not spray in any needle position -even with the needle backed out completely. The air path from the valve through the body is absolutely clear - checked with brass rodof the appropriate diameter . Switching the same hose to any of my three other brushes - Badger 150,
Badger 200 siphon feed , and Tamiya superfine HG ( Iwata ) reveals that the air supply is not the issue as they all work - swapping around tips/ washers on the Badgers shows that all tips work on the 150 and 200 siphon ( which by way of being siphon feed is even more reliant on adequate pressure ) but none will work on the gravity feed brush . There is obviously something wrong in the body of the gravity brush that I do not understand- frustrating but for 12 bucks and some postage I'll let Badger figure it out .
Your Baffled friend - Richard
Badger 200 siphon feed , and Tamiya superfine HG ( Iwata ) reveals that the air supply is not the issue as they all work - swapping around tips/ washers on the Badgers shows that all tips work on the 150 and 200 siphon ( which by way of being siphon feed is even more reliant on adequate pressure ) but none will work on the gravity feed brush . There is obviously something wrong in the body of the gravity brush that I do not understand- frustrating but for 12 bucks and some postage I'll let Badger figure it out .
Your Baffled friend - Richard
Robbd01
#323
Member Since: February 13, 2013
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Posted: Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 11:35 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Russ - Thanks for the response and the help . I have plenty of air through to the nozzle . Even the least viscous fluids simply will not flow out of the cup. The path from the cup to the nozzle is absolutely clear - it will not spray in any needle position -even with the needle backed out completely. The air path from the valve through the body is absolutely clear - checked with brass rodof the appropriate diameter . Switching the same hose to any of my three other brushes - Badger 150,
Badger 200 siphon feed , and Tamiya superfine HG ( Iwata ) reveals that the air supply is not the issue as they all work - swapping around tips/ washers on the Badgers shows that all tips work on the 150 and 200 siphon ( which by way of being siphon feed is even more reliant on adequate pressure ) but none will work on the gravity feed brush . There is obviously something wrong in the body of the gravity brush that I do not understand- frustrating but for 12 bucks and some postage I'll let Badger figure it out .
Your Baffled friend - Richard
I have had to send a few of my Badger AB's in for repair over the years. One AB I have had since the mid '80's. In each case the repair was free and I had to just pay postage. Be prepared they may take a few weeks.
Cheers
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, February 18, 2018 - 02:10 AM UTC
Can you get liquid to flow from the cup out through the front end if you remove all the parts enclosed in a "box" in the image above? Do this with and without the needle.
I have had similar problems but they all boiled down to dirt/paint somewhere in the flow but since you say that everything is spotlessly clean ...
/ Robin
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Sunday, February 18, 2018 - 03:42 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Can you get liquid to flow from the cup out through the front end if you remove all the parts enclosed in a "box" in the image above? Do this with and without the needle.
I have had similar problems but they all boiled down to dirt/paint somewhere in the flow but since you say that everything is spotlessly clean ...
/ Robin
Hi Robin - thanks for the help . With the tip removed Liquid will flow - as this has a permanent cup on the top the needle orafice can be seen . With the tip in place nothing happens regardless of air pressure or needle position when the trigger is depressed yet the same tip will work on my other brushes and there is plenty of air flow to the nozzle . The needle is the correct one for this tip and it is straight,sharp and clean and concentric with the tip . What gives ??
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, February 18, 2018 - 05:10 AM UTC
The only cause that comes to mind is paint residue in 50-0381/50-0382 but since you say that this part works fine when mounted on your other brushes....
When you say that air comes through the nozzle I assume that this means that air comes out at the front with the complete head/tip assembly in place?
Baffled ...
When you say that air comes through the nozzle I assume that this means that air comes out at the front with the complete head/tip assembly in place?
Baffled ...
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Sunday, February 18, 2018 - 05:51 AM UTC
Yes it does - as to sufficient volume with tip in place it is difficult to assess because the orifice in the tip is so small . The air path from the valve is through two intersecting cross drilled holes. Both are clear as proven by inserting two brass rods of the appropriate diameter through both holes until they meet - by gently pushing on one and pulling the other you can feel them meet and over ride each other. The exit for the air at the nozzle end is one hole - the tip has three holes which bring the air around and past the needle oriface at the tip creating a Venturi effect and thus a vacuum drawing the paint or other liquid out of the cup. None of the three air holes in the tip need be aligned with the single air hole in the body because the recess in the end of the body acts as a raceway distributing the air to the three holes in the tip. There is plenty of airflow out of this single hole when the tip is removed and all four holes in the tip ( three airways and one needle are visibly and tactily clear (soft copper wire of the appropriate diameter run through all ) - plus the tip works on the other brushes . Even if the airflow is insufficient there should be some flow of some sort of low viscosity liquids but there is none - ???
Still Baffled
Still Baffled
PRH001
Member Since: June 16, 2014
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Posted: Sunday, February 18, 2018 - 09:10 AM UTC
If the Teflon needle bushing 50-046 is missing or gouged you won’t generate vacuum to pull paint into the head assembly, it will bleed back into the body. I had this happen on a Badger 100 body 10 or 11 years ago. If it is damaged, I’d recommend sending it to Badger. You can do it yourself, but Badger will replace the needle bearing and make sure the rest of the brush is up to snuff at the same time.
Paul H
Paul H
RobinNilsson
Director of Member ServicesMember Since: November 29, 2006
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Posted: Sunday, February 18, 2018 - 12:53 PM UTC
Quoted Text
If the Teflon needle bushing 50-046 is missing or gouged you won’t generate vacuum to pull paint into the head assembly, it will bleed back into the body.....
Paul H
What happens if you use the head assembly from the 150 or the 200 siphon feed instead?
The needle bushing will be the same as well as the needle. If the other head works then the problem is not with the bushing.
If all heads fail when used with the 200G then the problem is in the body of the 200G. If the other heads work then the 200G is innocent and the fault is probably in the head of the 200G.
/ Robin
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Monday, March 19, 2018 - 01:52 AM UTC
I have received the repaired airbrush from Badger. The invoice states they replaced the tip which was cracked, the needle bearing and it also had a medium tip and needle with a fine regulator. I don't know if one of these faults caused the problem in and of itself or the problem was accumulative. I suspect the latter .
At any rate , hats off to Badger - no charge except for shipping and fast turn around.
Mystery solved ? Hmm - not so sure .
Thanks to all who tried to help - Richard
At any rate , hats off to Badger - no charge except for shipping and fast turn around.
Mystery solved ? Hmm - not so sure .
Thanks to all who tried to help - Richard
RobinNilsson
Director of Member ServicesMember Since: November 29, 2006
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Posted: Monday, March 19, 2018 - 01:54 AM UTC
At least the repairs explain why it worked with one head and not the other.
sgtreef
Member Since: March 01, 2002
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Posted: Monday, March 19, 2018 - 05:17 AM UTC
Missed this glad you got it fixed.
I have an old 150 that I bought in 1974, that stopped working many years back, I think with your reply from badger I might just send it to them for repair. I always liked that brush as was my first, and painted like crazy.
On to an email to badger.
I have an old 150 that I bought in 1974, that stopped working many years back, I think with your reply from badger I might just send it to them for repair. I always liked that brush as was my first, and painted like crazy.
On to an email to badger.
rdt1953
Member Since: February 06, 2015
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Posted: Monday, March 19, 2018 - 05:53 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Missed this glad you got it fixed.
I have an old 150 that I bought in 1974, that stopped working many years back, I think with your reply from badger I might just send it to them for repair. I always liked that brush as was my first, and painted like crazy.
On to an email to badger.
Just go to their web site. Instructions are there for sending in repairs .
Richard
Kevlar06
Member Since: March 15, 2009
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Posted: Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 09:49 PM UTC
Richard,
I missed the answer to your AB problem Monday too-- but the cracked tip explains a lot. I've had that problem at one time with my old Badger 200 too. I now keep a jewelers loop on my workbench tool rack just for that problem (although I don't use my 200 much anymore). I use the loop to carefully inspect the tips of all my air brushes while cleaning to detect cracks. ABs are so reflective and fine you can't see these hairline cracks with the naked eye, and even when wearing an optivisor they aren't always apparent. The jeweler's loop provides a very detailed examination. The cause of the hairline crack is usually from tightening the needle nut beyond finger tight, forcing the needle past the narrow opening of the tip. This allows air pressure to escape past the tip, which reduces the vacuum in the cup.
VR, Russ
I missed the answer to your AB problem Monday too-- but the cracked tip explains a lot. I've had that problem at one time with my old Badger 200 too. I now keep a jewelers loop on my workbench tool rack just for that problem (although I don't use my 200 much anymore). I use the loop to carefully inspect the tips of all my air brushes while cleaning to detect cracks. ABs are so reflective and fine you can't see these hairline cracks with the naked eye, and even when wearing an optivisor they aren't always apparent. The jeweler's loop provides a very detailed examination. The cause of the hairline crack is usually from tightening the needle nut beyond finger tight, forcing the needle past the narrow opening of the tip. This allows air pressure to escape past the tip, which reduces the vacuum in the cup.
VR, Russ
RobinNilsson
Director of Member ServicesMember Since: November 29, 2006
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Posted: Tuesday, March 20, 2018 - 10:07 PM UTC
I learned this on my first airbrush, the Badger 150 look-a-like made by Kager (in Korea??). Cracking the tip is not a good idea.
Bought some extra replacement tips but I have managed to avoid making that mistake again.
If the needle is ever so slightly to far forward it will "slam" into the tip when the trigger is released. The pressure from the spring pressing the needle and trigger forward will eventually crack the tip.
There is nothing on an airbrush that requires force to work properly ....
/ Robin
Bought some extra replacement tips but I have managed to avoid making that mistake again.
If the needle is ever so slightly to far forward it will "slam" into the tip when the trigger is released. The pressure from the spring pressing the needle and trigger forward will eventually crack the tip.
There is nothing on an airbrush that requires force to work properly ....
/ Robin
kevinekstrom
Member Since: December 08, 2017
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Posted: Wednesday, March 21, 2018 - 06:12 PM UTC
Shoot, don't waste your time. send that gun to Badger, they honor their lifetime warranty and will have that gun back to you functioning like new. I always send them my guns for tune ups. Their customer service is second to none.
My gun was bubbling back into the cup, I took it apart and cleaned it, checked the seals and gave it another go, still same issue. Instead of banging my head on the desk and wasting time, I dropped it off at Badger, 16.00 dollars later the gun was functioning like new, plus Badger kicked in a spare head assembly and an extra needle, they also replaced my old blue foam in the case with brand new black foam.
This gun is over 20 years old and works as if new.
My gun was bubbling back into the cup, I took it apart and cleaned it, checked the seals and gave it another go, still same issue. Instead of banging my head on the desk and wasting time, I dropped it off at Badger, 16.00 dollars later the gun was functioning like new, plus Badger kicked in a spare head assembly and an extra needle, they also replaced my old blue foam in the case with brand new black foam.
This gun is over 20 years old and works as if new.
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