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Modeling in General: Advice on...
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Iwata TRN1 issues and help
imnewtomodels
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 05:17 AM UTC
I posted a month ago about problems I was having with my AB and Vallejo Model Air paint. For the first month the AB/paint wasn't giving me any issues. Then, all of a sudden, I couldn't get enough air to come out. I've cleaned the AB multiple times with Vallejo AB cleaner. I've made sure to use Vallejo paint thinner and their flow improver, but still no luck.

I broke off the little nozzle during my last cleaning so I replaced that along with a new needle (to eliminate the possibility that I some how bent the needle).

Once the new parts arrived I replaced them, hooked up the AB and in an little cup mixed some Vallejo paint with some Vallejo thinner and I still cannot get enough air to come out. Some did, but it was more splatter and even though I have the PSI set to 20 the air flow is weak.

So, my question is two fold.

#1) do I have a crappy airbrush? I've read nothing but good reviews about it, but maybe mine is a dud?


#2) Do I have to totally strip the AB down and clean every single little piece?


Quite posibly this is all user error and the AB just needs a deep cleaning, but I'm new and as much as I want to really enjoy this hobby, if the AB needs this much maintenance, then maybe I have to question how much I really want to do this.

Is this an issue of the median I'm using? Are acrylics that fast drying that the second they come into contact with air it solidifies? If there is another paint out there that won't dry so damn fast, I'll start all over again. I'm horribly frustrated as I have 2 models that need painting and I want to get to my favorite part....weathering.


I appreciate any guidance here.
Vicious
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 06:07 AM UTC
If you want to stay with water based acrilics but you dont want to mess to much with thinning etc... go with MMP

https://www.missionmodelsus.com/


the only acrylic that has convinced me to leave enamels,if you are not sure search some review on youtube,they are awesome,seems to be more expensive but in the end the cost is the same as the others,if you read the istruction from MMP they spray nearly like a laquer

For the AB,yes you have to keep it well and beautifully clean but is no need to disassemble it completely every time, I do it only occasionally.
varanusk
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 01:17 PM UTC
if the airflow is weak it will probably be with any other paint... Vallejo is not bad, specially if you are using their own thinner and flow improver.

First, blow only air with the cup empty and see if there is enough pressure. If so, then try spraying just water and see what happens.

If it fails with only air the problem may be the compressor, the connector too tightly screwed or the airbrush air valve. If it is fine but water does not come out smoothly then it maybe dried paint inside the airbrush. And if water comes out fine it may be also dried paint but a tiny bit somewhere...
Scarred
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 02:30 PM UTC
Can you shoot any other type of liquid like water, windex or alcohol out of it? Test to see if it can.
Vicious
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 03:17 PM UTC
Personally when I have problem with the AB I use to test food colouring is cheap,you can clean easily with water,because have colour you can understand better if spray properly or not compared to water or other liquids,I play little on a paper
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 05:29 PM UTC
One possibility is that your way of cleaning has caused snall amounts of paint to enter the air channels.

1.Remove the hose from the airbrush and check that there is enough air coming out of the hose from the compressor (no point in troubleshooting the airbrush if the airflow is blocked/reduced before the airbrush)

2. If there is plenty air pressure in the hose.
Remove the front end parts and the needle from the airbrush. Attach the hose and check that air comes through the airbrush. If the needle has to be in place to make the air regulation work then leave it in the airbrush.
If the air doesn't come through you will have to check the seals and stuff in the hose connection, the stuff inside the handgrip.

3. If the air comes through the main body of the airbrush you proceed with checking the air channels in the front end parts. Reassemble the airbrush one part at the time to make it easier to identify the part causing the problem.

Many years ago I had air flow problem and the issue was one of the seals in the hose attachment point.

/ Robin
imnewtomodels
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 07:41 PM UTC
Air does come through but the pressure doesn't seem that great. When I put my hand near the quick connect value and the regulator I do feel some leaking so I'm going to double check my connections.

Water will come out and it's a mist, but again, it looks/sounds kinda weak.

Looks like I'm going to have to completely take apart the AB and check the seals as I've yet to go that far in breaking it down.

Even with a new nozzle and needles I'm not sure how gunked up paint can be an issue, but like I said, I'm still new to this.

Thanks
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 07:48 PM UTC
What kind of airflow do you get at the open end of the hose?
Compressor -> regulator & moisture trap -> hose -> no airbrush

I have never disassembled this type of airbrush so I'm sort of flying blind here, based on the parts diagram.


My assumptions based on the diagram above.
Air comes up through 22-21-20 into the main body, there it is controlled somehow by the movement of 19, somehow pushing on the combination of parts 8 to 17. Air should flow around the tip of the needle in the space laft in part 3 when the needle is pulled back. Something separates the paint from the airflow somewhere in the vicinity of parts 5 & 6. I assume that there is a channel/duct for air through part 5 ig part 6 is a seal. Paint is around the needle and part 6 keeps the paint away from the air. If 6 gets broken or untight there would be air bubbles in the cup (30 or 29) If paint has clogged up an air "duct" somewhere in the main body between 5/6 and and the threads where part 20 comes in you could get a reduced airflow.

/ Robin

full size image:
https://www.graphicair.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Neo-Series-For-Iwata-TRN1.jpg
Scarred
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Posted: Sunday, November 19, 2017 - 08:59 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Personally when I have problem with the AB I use to test food colouring is cheap,you can clean easily with water,because have colour you can understand better if spray properly or not compared to water or other liquids,I play little on a paper


Colored water, never thought of that. I just used water or thinners against a paper towel.

Robins' got the right idea about checking air flow but don't just stop with the hose. If the airflow is weak, disconnect it from the trap and test the airflow at the trap. If it's weak there disconnect it from the regulator and then test the regulator by opening and closing it all the way a few times if you still get weak air flow then your problem is the compressor. Now, sometimes with cheap compressors the dial on the regulator might not be accurate. It may say you are shooting 20 psi but you could be shooting higher or lower than that.
imnewtomodels
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Posted: Monday, November 20, 2017 - 01:36 AM UTC
I tried putting on a moisture trap but after I did I wasn't able to control the PSI. It's operator error as I'm new to this all.

I just need to spend a weekend trying to figure all this out. I really enjoyed the 4 kits I was able to assemble and paint, but now I'm stuck and a little frustrated.

Thanks for all the advice.
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, November 20, 2017 - 01:53 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I tried putting on a moisture trap but after I did I wasn't able to control the PSI. It's operator error as I'm new to this all.

I just need to spend a weekend trying to figure all this out. I really enjoyed the 4 kits I was able to assemble and paint, but now I'm stuck and a little frustrated.

Thanks for all the advice.



An airbrush is a very useful tool but it can be a little temperamental
When my pressure regulator started failing it had me frustrated for a while until I figured out what was wrong.
A new regulator and moisture trap (the ones that came with the compressor were combined into one part) and verything worked just fine until the tank developed a leak (rusted through). The water outlet is very hard to get at so that's why I failed to check it often enough, the moisture trap never had any moisture in it. The compressor also started losing its "breath", turned out to be a clogged air inlet filter, paint dust had been sucked into the ceramic filter and clogged it. Live and learn I suppose.

Back to basic troubleshooting, check one part of the system at the time.
Disconnect hose from compressor and check for air flow, check that the air flow can be regulated. You may need to remove the quick connect thingy, the one between the moisture trap and the pressure regulator in this image:
assuming you still have the same setup.
Maybe you can unscrew the moisture trap from the quick connect ...
If you dont get air now you will need to remove the pressure regulator, it could be faulty or clogged by something so that it doesn't let the air through.

Next you attach the hose without the airbrush to check that the air is still coming through

Basically you remove parts of the system working towards the tank to figure out where the air is getting blocked.
/ Robin
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