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Modeling in General: Decals
Trouble with decals?
Academy Decals Help???
retiredyank
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Posted: Friday, July 01, 2011 - 01:40 AM UTC
I have built several Academy kits, one of my fav brands. However, I hate their decals. They always silver on me. I make sure my topcoat is dry, give it three passes with Future. Let that dry. Apply the decal. Let that set. Apply two more passes with Future. Let that dry. The decals look great, at this point. Three to four coats with MM Flat Clear and the decals silver.
What am I doing wrong? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Jessie_C
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Posted: Friday, July 01, 2011 - 06:11 AM UTC
Academy decals can be charitably said to be not the best around. If you can't find replacements, try placing them on a little puddle of wet Future. This way you can be sure that all the air pockets will be filled, and the Future will help them to conform to the surface as it dries.

J
retiredyank
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Posted: Friday, July 01, 2011 - 09:24 AM UTC
Thanks Jessie. I'll try that. I can't find any decals apropriate for a M163 during Vietnam.
rebelsoldier
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Posted: Sunday, July 03, 2011 - 04:09 AM UTC
i didn't see what you used to help the decals set up before you applied future topcoat. i use white vinegar to set my decals and after that dries then its the last future coating. i have a few academy models that are around 5 or 6 years old, and no decal problems. if you choose to try it this way please let me know your results.

reb
old-dragon
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Posted: Sunday, July 03, 2011 - 07:06 AM UTC
Matt, I've had that happen with other model brands decals too and what I've done is use micro scale solva-set after mutliple pin pricks...redo as needed. I used to use the micro scale setting solution and solva-set together but found that some decals can get trashed by that - my ghost buster ECTO-1a for example, the combo totally rippled the decal edges and even after multiple applications of solva-set they won't lay down- ouch, so I now use it only when needed.
Hope this helps-
retiredyank
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Posted: Sunday, July 03, 2011 - 07:30 AM UTC

Quoted Text

i didn't see what you used to help the decals set up before you applied future topcoat. i use white vinegar to set my decals and after that dries then its the last future coating. i have a few academy models that are around 5 or 6 years old, and no decal problems. if you choose to try it this way please let me know your results.

reb


I haven't used anything to help the decals set up. I have heard about using vinegar. Do I dip the decal in vinegar or apply it to the surface of the model?
Bob. I can get ahold of MM decal solvent. Will this work as well as solvaset?
rebelsoldier
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Posted: Sunday, July 03, 2011 - 08:33 PM UTC
I haven't used anything to help the decals set up. I have heard about using vinegar. Do I dip the decal in vinegar or apply it to the surface of the model?

i use a spray bottle to apply on my decals then let dry after blotting edges with a q tip.

reb
lukiftian
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Posted: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 07:19 PM UTC
Academy decals are superb if you use Gunze Mr. Mark Softer. They go down just like paint with this product.
retiredyank
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Posted: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 09:40 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Academy decals are superb if you use Gunze Mr. Mark Softer. They go down just like paint with this product.


I think I am gong to try the vinegar route, as I have quite a lot of it.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 10:11 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Academy decals are superb if you use Gunze Mr. Mark Softer. They go down just like paint with this product.


I think I am gong to try the vinegar route, as I have quite a lot of it.



I read a while time ago on a modeller magazine that if you want to make an home made decals softner you' have to use a mixture between Acetic acid and water (If I remember in a right way the ratio was 30% acid 70% distilled water)
You can use vinegar but it could be less effective. If you decide to use vinegar in my opinion you should use a cheap one because cheapest vinegars are more acid then they are more aggressive with decals

I hope this could help you
retiredyank
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Posted: Thursday, July 07, 2011 - 02:59 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Academy decals are superb if you use Gunze Mr. Mark Softer. They go down just like paint with this product.


I think I am gong to try the vinegar route, as I have quite a lot of it.



I read a while time ago on a modeller magazine that if you want to make an home made decals softner you' have to use a mixture between Acetic acid and water (If I remember in a right way the ratio was 30% acid 70% distilled water)
You can use vinegar but it could be less effective. If you decide to use vinegar in my opinion you should use a cheap one because cheapest vinegars are more acid then they are more aggressive with decals

I hope this could help you


I only buy cheap vinegar. Thanks for the heads up.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Thursday, July 07, 2011 - 03:42 AM UTC
You're welcome

Be careful vinegar is white. Red one may stain the decals in my opinion

cheers
retiredyank
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Posted: Thursday, July 07, 2011 - 07:22 AM UTC

Quoted Text

You're welcome

Be careful vinegar is white. Red one may stain the decals in my opinion

cheers


Thanks for the tip. I don't even have red vinegar.
lukiftian
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Posted: Thursday, July 07, 2011 - 04:21 PM UTC
Yes, I can tell.

Good Luck
retiredyank
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Posted: Thursday, July 07, 2011 - 08:46 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Yes, I can tell.

Good Luck


if the vinegar doesn't work, I'll try the decal softener. But, I still have several weeks before I am ready to apply the decals.
lukiftian
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Posted: Friday, July 08, 2011 - 07:19 AM UTC
I don't advise using vinegar on these decals.

Micro Set has a bit of acetic acid in it, if that doesn't work then the stronger solution that is regular vinegar definitely will not

Gunze Mr. Mark Setter is formulated for these types of decals, especially large stubborn ones being placed over compound surfaces. If you're not doing this, if your surface is relatively flat, then Mark Softer will do.

But even so Matt, I took numbers from a Tamiya sheet and placed them over zimmerit, then a few applications of Mark Softer, and they sucked down right over the corrugated surface.

If you do use it, one item to remember is not to freak out when they start to crinkle on the surface, do not touch or disturb them, they will flatten out.

This stuff is designed for Tamiya, Hasegawa, Academy, Dragon and other Asian decals, but also works on Cartograf decals with superb results.
retiredyank
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Posted: Friday, July 08, 2011 - 07:40 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I don't advise using vinegar on these decals.

Micro Set has a bit of acetic acid in it, if that doesn't work then the stronger solution that is regular vinegar definitely will not

Gunze Mr. Mark Setter is formulated for these types of decals, especially large stubborn ones being placed over compound surfaces. If you're not doing this, if your surface is relatively flat, then Mark Softer will do.

But even so Matt, I took numbers from a Tamiya sheet and placed them over zimmerit, then a few applications of Mark Softer, and they sucked down right over the corrugated surface.

If you do use it, one item to remember is not to freak out when they start to crinkle on the surface, do not touch or disturb them, they will flatten out.

This stuff is designed for Tamiya, Hasegawa, Academy, Dragon and other Asian decals, but also works on Cartograf decals with superb results.


Ok. I'll have to find some online as my LHS only carries Testors/MM decal softener and set.
lukiftian
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Posted: Friday, July 08, 2011 - 07:47 AM UTC
That MM flat clear you're using, is that the lacquer based product? The solvent could be lifting your decals and silvering them. I've sometimes had the surface collapse if I use too much future underneath and too much dullcote over top, too quickly in succession.

Pollyscale does an acrylic flat clear that's easy to spray and eliminates this problem.
retiredyank
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Posted: Saturday, July 09, 2011 - 03:54 AM UTC
It is the laquer based clear coat. I can get some Pollyscale from my LHS. Will give that a try if the Future tip doesn't work.
rebelsoldier
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Posted: Friday, July 15, 2011 - 05:53 AM UTC
hows it going?
reb
retiredyank
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Posted: Friday, July 15, 2011 - 06:53 AM UTC
It's been raining for the past few days. I need to spray paint and future, but I have to do so outside. No progress, yet.
rebelsoldier
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Posted: Friday, July 15, 2011 - 07:45 AM UTC
thanks for the quick response, will keep checking back, this is a great thread!

reb
retiredyank
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Posted: Friday, July 15, 2011 - 03:07 PM UTC
I should be able to try out all the tips tomorrow. Low chance of rain.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Friday, July 15, 2011 - 06:16 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I don't advise using vinegar on these decals.

Micro Set has a bit of acetic acid in it, if that doesn't work then the stronger solution that is regular vinegar definitely will not

Gunze Mr. Mark Setter is formulated for these types of decals, especially large stubborn ones being placed over compound surfaces. If you're not doing this, if your surface is relatively flat, then Mark Softer will do.

But even so Matt, I took numbers from a Tamiya sheet and placed them over zimmerit, then a few applications of Mark Softer, and they sucked down right over the corrugated surface.

If you do use it, one item to remember is not to freak out when they start to crinkle on the surface, do not touch or disturb them, they will flatten out.

This stuff is designed for Tamiya, Hasegawa, Academy, Dragon and other Asian decals, but also works on Cartograf decals with superb results.



Yes, that's it. Micro sol smells (terribly) like acid acetic, that's the reason why the magazine which I've read gave the self made recipe. It was a cheaper alternativo to micro sol. But to be honest I read that article many years ago, when Mr Mark softner hadn't already been sold in western countries.
I agree with Kevin, Gunze product actually is incredibly effective, cheaper than micro sol and...and less smelly...
I really hope you'll be able to fix your decal problems Matt. Although Pollyscale products are unavailable here in Italy, I'm quite curious to see how will go

Have a good luck!

cheers
rebelsoldier
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Posted: Monday, July 25, 2011 - 05:17 PM UTC
how ya doin matt?
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