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Modeling in General
General discussions about modeling topics.
Annealing PE? When and when not to do it?
Dogwatch
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Posted: Saturday, February 27, 2010 - 09:54 PM UTC
Im still pretty new to working with PE and was wondering when and when you aren't supposed to anneal the metal. It seems incredibly soft already but Ive noticed that Eduard and Dragon PE feel very different (dont have any experience with the other companies like Aber etc.). Does annealing help strengthen the brass in any way (like hardening with metalworking)? Ive had a couple of pieces where Ive broken very tiny attachment points off with no hope of recovery. Any other advice on PE? Im using The Bug as a folder and it works great.

Steve
Plasticbattle
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Posted: Saturday, February 27, 2010 - 10:15 PM UTC
Hi Steve. Annealing makes the etch more workable, especailly when you need curves and difficult shapes and the definition isnīt great. New Eduard etch is very thin, and probably doesnīt need it so much .... Dragon is thicker, and maybe isnīt as well etched so could benifit from annealing.
Emeritus
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2010 - 05:01 AM UTC
Depends on the metal used for the parts and the bends required. Heating up the parts and letting the cool down on their own takes off much of the springiness and also makes the parts easier to cut off the fret and clean up. For heating, I recommend a lighter, as using a candle will most likely result in soot on the parts.
I've normally had to resort to annealing only with PE parts made of steel, for example those found on older Dragon kits. When using such parts, I normally anneal all parts that need any kind of bending.

Btw, despite its colour, Eduard's PE isn't made of steel, it just has a steely-looking coating, nickel if I recall correctly.

Dogwatch
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2010 - 05:26 AM UTC
Thanks for the reply. The Eduard sheet I currently have is brass...didnt even know they made steel I know that annealing is to soften the metal up, but it seems so soft already that I wasnt sure if it was necessary or when it needed to be done. The Dragon PE on my kit (6301) feels about twice the thickness of the Eduard PE but it too is brass.
old-dragon
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2010 - 02:39 PM UTC
Annealing removes the temper the metal "had"..or the set memory of being flat. It makes it softer. Easier to bend....... or get distorted.
Heat treating makes it harder by a "long term heating".
GeraldOwens
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2010 - 03:09 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Im still pretty new to working with PE and was wondering when and when you aren't supposed to anneal the metal. It seems incredibly soft already but Ive noticed that Eduard and Dragon PE feel very different (dont have any experience with the other companies like Aber etc.). Does annealing help strengthen the brass in any way (like hardening with metalworking)? Ive had a couple of pieces where Ive broken very tiny attachment points off with no hope of recovery. Any other advice on PE? Im using The Bug as a folder and it works great.

Steve


Annealing softens the metal, allowing it to be bent more easily (though the metal must be allowed to cool naturally, not quenched in water).
Eduard photoetch is as soft as foil, so don't even think about annealing it. In fact, treat it very gently, and always cut straight down when freeing parts from the fret, as it is possible to pull some parts out shape laterally. Since many of their parts are built up in layers, this can be a disaster, as they will no longer line up.
Some brands use a heavier gauge brass, and might benefit from annealing, but the only brand I've found that absolutely needed it was Royal Models. Not only would it refuse to bend, it was actually warped in the wrong direction.
Older Dragon kits, like the first batches of their Jagdtiger kits and their Panzer IV kits from the 1990's, used steel photoetch, which can be very difficult to work with, and is probably best replaced with brass.
Ranger74
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Posted: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 - 10:06 AM UTC
I have found that PE used in Bronco kits needs annealing if you need to curve it. I laid the parts on top of my smooth top electirc stove. Works pleanty good.

Jeff
HawkeyeV
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Posted: Thursday, March 04, 2010 - 02:16 AM UTC
The easy way to tell if the PE you are using needs annealing is to snip off a piece of the fret frame and see how easy it bends and if it holds the shape you bent it into. If it is hard, you probably should anneal it. Hot sooty heat from a candle is enough.

airraid
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Posted: Saturday, March 06, 2010 - 07:18 PM UTC
hi guys

What you need to consider is the type of metal used. Ferrous metals such as steel soften if heated then left to cool and harden if heated then quenched.For non ferrous metals such as brass the reverse is the case as brass/aluminium(aluminun)etc work harden.The more you bend it the harder it gets. This is why brass breaks if you bend it. In some cases if repeated bending is required you may have to anneal the brass more than once.

As a rule of thumb if it's magnetic heat then leave to cool to soften the metal.
If it's non magnetic heat then quench for the same effect.

When I left school I trained as a sheet metal worker. Hope this helps in some way.

Den
metooshelah
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Posted: Monday, March 08, 2010 - 08:54 AM UTC
Have used aber, voyager and eduard PE with no annealing. Only done it once with dragon PE (light guards for sherman) and while the parts were easier to bend they lacked toughness and would get distorted by just breathing on them. Since then i do not anneal any part.
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