My favorite history site is down right now and I wanted to post this somewher. Today is July 1st, 140 years ago the three day battle of Gettysburg in the American Civil War began. I wonder how does this battle rate internationally in the list of great battles of the world?

As pivotal impact, it has to be up there. If the Confederacy had prevailed, at best, there would have been a negotiated peace between the North and South, leaving essentially two countries here. That would have had a major impact on the ability of the US to help turn the tide in Europe in 1918, with the possibility of a more favorable outcome in the negotiations for Germany. A stronger Germany at that point could have resulted in less of a power base for Hitler, since hte Germans would not have felt so disempowered. If the Treaty of Versailles had remained the same, the rise of Hitler would have been unchanged and the weaker United States would not have had the overall industrial base to support the allies.

I agree with AJ but I don't think that a Confederate victory at Gettysburg would have changed the eventual outcome of the war, just postponed the inevitable Confederate defeat. The South still would not have had the manufacturing, transportation, or manpower base to defeat the North. Just my opininage...

Shaun

Great subject, guys.

In my totally un-tutored opinion. Grant would have come East sooner. More and bloodier battles to come... maybe... Grant vs Lee in '63. Woulda been interesting.

New book on alternate history. "Gettysburg" by Willian Forstchen and Newt Gingrich. Lee takes personal command at Gettysburg rather than delegate. Day 1 and Day 2 are more decisive resulting in the battle of annhilation that Lee originally sought. Highly recommended!

I'm curious, how could he take personal command? He would have had to have been in too many places at once. That might work on defense, like Wellington at Waterloo, but I can't see how an army commander could take personal command on offense.

Halfyank, Cell phones, of course. Anyone else remember the "What If?" skits from SNL?
One I remember was "What if Eleanor Roosevelt could fly?"

#:-)

Shaun

cell phones... yes... that's it!

Halfyank - Agreed. It would have been difficult for Lee but not impossible. Without Jackson, Lee had to rely on Ewell and Early. Both performed poorly on Day 1. AP Hill was sick too. Day one on the Union right was almost as bad as Chancellorsville. No Jackson, though.

The book supposes that Lee recoginzes the weakness of these corp commanders and takes a much more active role in pushing the offensive.

Also, the round tops are occupied by the Army NV., too.

Yes, I know it's all speculataion. But, fun. I enjoy alternate history.

It would have been as simple as Ewell going after Culps hill at the same time Hood was going through the Peach Orchard moving on the Round Tops. This was the plan but Ewell took to long and didn't get moving until after Hood had pretty much pulled out of the fight.

Lee should have listened to Longstreet. That makes Gettysburg a skirmish and Lee troops on toward Harrisburg.
I do believe that the South's cause was lost once Lincoln proclaimed the Emancipation. That changes the focus of the war from State's Rights to Slavery, and the European powers would refuse to support a "Slaveocracy".
I have walked the field at Gettysburg twice. Once as a ten-year old with a blooming interest in history. Next as a 35-year old former Army officer with an eye toward the terrain. Each time was a powerful experience.

Bob,
I went to Gettysburg about 20 years ago on the First of July. You are right about it being a moving experience. I don't see how anyone could stand where Picket's Charge started and look across that huge stretch of open terrain to the Bloody Angle and not get chills.

Shaun

I want to go to Gettysburg some day, maybe for the 150th. I've been to Shiloh and it was moving. Looking at the "bloody pond" and the "hornet's nest" and all those tombstones was really something.

Gettysburg will be remembered as the "high water mark for the Confederacy." After this Battle the South waged primarily a defensive campaign and the Union began an 18 month war of attrition resulting the the surrender at Appomattix Court House.

The 140th reenactment has been moved up to the 8-10th of August due to the bad spring, so you have a chance to get to that one. I'll be there (10th Mass attached to 2nd Connecticut for the purposes of this event.)

I was in the film Gettysburg and i was an extra in Glory, there were actual regiments that were there represented. A reenactor next to me (Playing Fed) at the stonewall in pickett charge actually froze when we both looked up (againist orders) and saw the the entire reb army coming to see us. It can cause your blood to run cold. I has been a reenactor for about 13 years.