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Modeling in General
General discussions about modeling topics.
Some drifting thoughts
Envar
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 02:20 AM UTC
Model Expo launched today in Helsinki. For some reason I only got to know about it today morning. Maybe I was in coma or something.
Anyway, for the first time I attended in a model show with a figure diorama (my second one).
It was confusing to see all the other works in there when I put mine in. I thought I just wanted to try it out, what its like to actually place my work for people to see and judge. But when I saw the other works there, I felt awful because all I could see were the details I would have made in different fashion. And still, in every single model there was something truly personal, some part that made it clear that the maker loved his work. Which made me think about my own work.
All these years Ive had an illusion that all OTHER modelers are experts, pros, and that I would discraze myself (and my family) by signing my work in there.
What a foolish idea that was. Next to me a father said to his son, pointing at my work: "Hey! take a look at THAT!" What? they actually didnt see that glue stain in the back!
Here at Armorama, its easy to have that familiar "Im not worth it!" -feeling when magnificent pieces of work can be seen. But its not too difficult to adapt that feeling in a way that helps out when having hard time with some modeling project.
Another quote from my mentor: "Steal from the best!"
Here at Armorama I feel like being among the best. And no book can replace the resources of so many living persons and their experience and knowledge.

I got drifted away. I just wanted to point out that modeling is not about competition but sharing.

Thank you all.

Toni
m1garand
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 02:26 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I just wanted to point out that modeling is not about competition but sharing.



I agree completely. And also having fun. If you're not having fun, why do it?
YodaMan
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 02:40 AM UTC

Quoted Text

And still, in every single model there was something truly personal, some part that made it clear that the maker loved his work.


One of the reasons why I've built car models is that I probably will never own, or even drive, what I build a model of. Now that I'm into armor, I find it a way to pay respects to all those who have served for their country.
Quoted Text

All these years Ive had an illusion that all OTHER modelers are experts, pros, and that I would discraze myself (and my family) by signing my work in there.

That's pretty much the feeling that I got. For a while I was thinking that should build models so others would see they're great. But, that's not the point. I've started a collection of models because I like building them. I love having all these miniatures in my room that I can pick up any day and start making the appropriate sounds for! Vroom Vroom!!!

YodaMan
Go Red Wings!!!
Envar
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 02:46 AM UTC
Yoda please. Youre making me weep. Im in very emotional state because I just got my Schimmie....

Shes so beautiful..

Snif..

Toni
mj
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 04:20 AM UTC
I absolutely agree, Envar. I'm here because I love history, and love modeling a piece of it. I do it for me, not a judge at some meet. And if I can help somebody increase their skills (although, honestly, I'm more on the recieving end of that yet), I will happily do it.

I understand some people like the competition, but for me, my hobbies are about relaxation and enjoyment. I don't mean to sound pompous, but I don't care what you think about my model, I care what I think about it. I build to please myself...sometimes a very difficult task master.

Mike

Maki
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 02:59 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I don't mean to sound pompous, but I don't care what you think about my model, I care what I think about it. I build to please myself...sometimes a very difficult task master.



Well said.. I guess I'm the toughest critic when it comes to my models. You can say what you like, if I'm satisfied with it... then I'm happy.

Mario M.


ArmouredSprue
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 09:01 PM UTC
I do agree with everything that was said here..
Let's build our models and have fun...And if anybody would like to show your models in contests it's also good for the EGO
Cheers!
CaptainJack
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 09:07 PM UTC
Now we're getting into the Zen of the thing. Keep it up!!

Captain Jack
Trackjam
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 10:11 PM UTC
Couldn't agree more. The whole thing is about having fun. sharing ideas, experiences both in modeling and perhaps the military life. I get enough stress at work. I don't need any in my hobby. I build because I like to as does everyone else. I go to meets and competitions because they are fun. I have a few trophies but it matters little to me if I get any more. all they do is collect dust. Better on them than my models. (the models go in the glass case, the trophies don't). I fI can develop a techniques useful to someone else then I am happy that I might have contributed to his or her enjoyment of the hobby.
relichunter00
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 10:20 PM UTC
Tony,

I just wanted to thank you for what you said. I have been only modeling a few weeks and I will tell all that I have been totally overwhelmed by the expertise and knowledge of the people on this site. I've been working on my first model, a M41 bulldog, and If I get stuck on something I will go to Gunnie's website and look at his for reference. Then I just look at his and think there is no way I can make mine look like that, what I failed to realize is that this is MY model and I should do what I want and be proud of it. I know gunnie has been doing models for years probably,like the rest on this site, and that experience will come with time and practice, practice and practice.

I was painting the roadwheels the other night and my little 4 year old and my 10 year old were having a ball handing me this piece and that piece. This is what I have enjoyed most about this hobby so far, is that I've always had hobbies that my kids could never really participate and enjoy with me, but this one they can(except for painting...4 year old...paint brush.....tiny parts.....not a pretty site) .


Sorry to get off on a tangent, but sometimes I feel I have nothing to contribute to the forum, because I don't know much about modeling yet, but maybe there someone else that will read this that was feeling the same way. I have decided to keep modeling FUN and let the other details work itself out.

Thanks to all so far for all your help.....and Gunnie that is ONE GOOD LOOKING BULLDOG!!! :-)


Anthony
TreadHead
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Posted: Friday, April 26, 2002 - 11:44 PM UTC
Some time ago I was going to start a thread that was going to be titled something like, "What does modeling mean to you?" I never got around to it, but fortunately it looks like our good friend Envar has.
So, I'll join in.
I have always been a great fan of observing human behaviour, whether under stress, or when elated. The human animal has, and always will be a great source of entertainment for me. Regarding modeling, I used to think that people were fairy predictable, i.e., young kids built car models, old men built military models, geeks built sci-fi models, and almost every ship builder was an old sailor. I came to believe this because when I attended shows or local competitions, that's pretty much what you found. Very few teenagers were sitting behind the armour table for example, and I don't think anyone behind the car table was over 30!
But that has changed over the years. Now you see all kinds of people behind all kinds of tables. Young people building aircraft and military, old farts building cars, (but the old sailors are still building ships )
I'm not sure what or how that change came about, but I'm soulfully glad it did. My only suspicion is that us 'Baby Boomer's' had something to do with it. I'd like to think that it was us boomer's that taught our kids to respect the sacrifices that we and our father's made to give them the life's freedoms and luxuries that they enjoy today. I think the young people, the majority anyway, observe the precarious nature of the world in general by watching it everyday on the local news. They are more intelligent than we were, and hence can do the math.
I, for one, am really glad to see young people like YodaMan enjoying the hobby. Yeah, I know I'm always teasing him, but Yoda's a great example of a young man with a good respect for things, and a good head on his shoulders to boot! Here's a guy who obviously enjoys modeling armour, cars and sci-fi with the same enthusiasm for each. Good guy. I can't tell you how glad it makes my heart to see young people like that.
Modeling is a hobby. Something we all invest time and money into. So our choices within that context are important ones. I don't think that the mindset of the modeler is frivilous. It couldn't be. We deal in a micro-world of detail, detail, detail. I think the energy that one expends modeling is a conglomeration of emotions, belief's, and intellectual satisfaction.
Going out on a limb here, generally speaking, military modelers build their armour, aircraft, ships and figures not only because it interests them (intellectual satisfaction), but also because it is in a small personal way, an 'homage' to the era, men and individual investment of our forefathers (belief's). Additionally, the older car modelers that are emerging and filling both the ranks and the hobby store ailses are not building just any old kit, they're building cars that they used to drive or wanted to drive when they were young (emotion).
So, in closing this ramble of mine, modeling is a great source of both pleasure and pain. Pleasure, when we complete a particular procedure correctly, or the paint effect we were trying for turns out just right. Pain, when it doesn't, or something goes wrong. Kinda like life, don't you think? Now here's the kicker. Want to know what the difference is? Control. This little portion of life I can Control. That's not to say modelers are 'control freaks'. (although there could be truth lurking there) It just means that there is a general sense of well being when you are in control. Think about it. When modeling your Panzer diorama, you control every little
nuance of that mini-world. Every choice, placement, colour, layout, detail, etc, etc. Yours to control.
That's why modeling is such a source of pleasure for us all. It allows us to completely feel in control of at least some small part of our world. It allows us to paint that world in whatever colour we choose, whether good or bad. It allows us to add the detail to that world that Best describes it. It allows us to place just the right people 'in the picture' for the best affect. And finally, it allows us caress that peaceful place inside us that some people have called your 'center'.

Tread.

Is that enough 'ZEN' for ya Captain Jack??

Sorry for the above remarks all, I think I've lost my 'Id' ......
Bravo-Comm
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 01:30 AM UTC
:-) :-) :-) Thanks Tread you pretty much summed it up properly. You have touched on the very reason why I model. And how I feel about it. Though lately I have become somewhat wrapped up in trying to be sure that everyone sees them as I complete each one VAIN ?? I hope not !! I guess deep down it is because I do not have the ability to attend meets and shows, So the internet is a easy acess for me. AS are sites like this one. "BUT" I learn things here too. "MUST REMEMBER TO ENJOY" "NOT OBSESS" (LOL) Anyway thanks for your words of wisdom and Absolute ZEN !! And I will strive to create more for myself as I used to. But still learn and share what I can.

DAGGER : A weapon with a short pointed Blade:" THE CUTTING EDGE"
TreadHead
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 02:02 AM UTC
No, thank you Dagger-1! I'm just glad my psycho-babble made sense and wasn't too 'deep' for everyone. I know this site is mainly to have fun and enjoy, but sometimes it can also be a soundingboard.
Sometimes the soap box slides out from the safe I keep it in and I can't stop myself

Tread.
Bravo-Comm
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 03:44 AM UTC
Sounding Boards are Good, Sounding Boards are Wise, UHHM GOOD, WISE, Sounds LIKE...... "VICTORY" He-He-He. "Don't Forgit to smile when you say that Pilgrum"
Oh did I also mention I like to Have fun here too......"LOOK MA"........"TOP OF THE WORLD"
I Wike He's Silly...He-He-He.


DAGGER-1
maxpain
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 06:44 AM UTC
Very interesting analysis there Tread!

I can only agree with what has been said.. being new to the hobby I don't feel I can contribute much with help, advice or whatever else. Looking at the gallery I experience the same feelings as many of you.. but on the other hand I get a good chunk of motivation out of this site. Having worked in in an area where precision and accuracy is highlty important to satisfy the customer I feel I have a solid base to get to the point where I can produce good looking results..

There is no 'mine looks better than..' - whoever posts here tries to help and give advice. The peeps are very mature and friendly! Every time I get back to my baby (err :-) my computer that is..) I click on the armorama link which sits right in my link bar at the top of my browser to check what's been going on.

I hope I will be able to help others somewhen the same way you guys are helping and motivating me now !!!!!
YodaMan
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 06:45 AM UTC
Gee, after reading through a thread like this I have only one thing to say; Gee! Is this site swell or what?
Great comments Tread! You too Dagger. And Relichunter, and Fredenburg, and captainjack and ArmoredSprue and Maki, M1, mj and of course Envar. (where'd you get that cool rank insignia? It rocks!)
Good news, I'll be getting my air compressor tomorrow, so I'll actually be working on a model again! Wait..... I need an airbrush. Gee, must life be so complicated? ::sigh:: :-)

YodaMan
Go Red Wings!!!
ARENGCA
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 07:23 AM UTC
Whew! Well said, Tread. I certainly hope that I can pass some of that on to my kids. I have never looked too deeply into the philosophy of what we do, but on some level I think that it all was there. What you wrote was right on, all down the line.

Reaching back futher in the thread, I wanted to respond to the discussion about "whether my stuff is good enough". A few years back I was painting D&D figures, for a break. The manager of the gaming shop near here (since closed) encouraged me to enter a fig into a painting contest they were having. I hesitated, because I didn't think my stuff was good enough. After considering it for a while, and with more prodding by the manager, I finally decided to just do it and see what happened. I won.

I didn't expect the call when I got it, and I was pretty surprised. But it goes to show that sometimes we are our own harshest critics. The tiny details that we see as wrong or inaccurate or not built right don't matter to most other folks. They look at the model (or fig, or dio) and see what we originally saw in the model. They see the whole thing, the picture we made, and they appreciate what they see. Those who see the same inaccuracies we do still appreciate the effort and time we put it to the model, because to notice the inaccuracies means they are probably one of us. So, don't hesitate to enter that "sort of OK" model you built in the next contest. It might be the winner!

With that in mind, I am planning to build an M113, and write an article for the Armorama contest. Maybe it will suck, but maybe you guys (gals, too!) will like it! Either way, I will learn a little, grow a bit, and try something I never have. It's all good.
CaptainJack
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 07:43 AM UTC
flip, flip, flip. The pages whizz by as Jack pusues a new line of Zen consciousness. That's it in a nutshell Tread. This is not only a simple modelers web site, it is a door to eternity, a wider and more profound vision of our existance. Modeling is the means by which we communicate. There are other paths but this one is ours. I think we all were led here for various reasons. Just remeber, there is no such thing in life as a coincidence. The theory of vacuous contrast. (for everything white there is something black, for eveything ...your basic Chinese Yin and Yang) Now there I go Tread! Zapped by the Zen gun again!

Jack
ArmouredSprue
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 08:04 AM UTC
Tread;
Ive touched me! I never ever thought about my modelling as deeper as you go, good things to think of
Cheers!
TreadHead
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 08:06 AM UTC
Wait a minute....were you the Zapper or was I the Zapper? Or maybe we're both Zappee's?

....."Zen is more than spiritual....."

Tread.
TreadHead
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 08:07 AM UTC
Hey Paulo........ :-) :-) :-) :-)
YodaMan
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 09:32 AM UTC
'Zapper or the Zappee'???
Hmmm, what about just plain 'zapped'? :-)

YodaMan
Go Red Wings!!!
CaptainJack
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 04:56 PM UTC
:-) Depends if it is a zap gun or a water pistol Yoda. Don't fire upon any helpless small wingless birds however. They are now behind 5-4. :-)
YodaMan
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Posted: Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 11:10 PM UTC
Nooo. The Red Wings won the game 6 - 4!!! :-)
They also move on to round #2!

YodaMan
Go Red Wings!!!
TreadHead
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Posted: Sunday, April 28, 2002 - 02:47 AM UTC

Quoted Text

:-) Depends if it is a zap gun or a water pistol Yoda. Don't fire upon any helpless small wingless birds however. They are now behind 5-4. :-)



Hmmmmm, I remember 'zip' guns from my younger days. We hand made them from wood and they were dangerous as hell! But I won't go into my rebelious childhood ....
 _GOTOTOP